Australian Family Cars: We have gone so far backwards since 2016... - Page 4

**DJM83** · 24-12-2023, 02:25 PM

How many have failed vs how many they have made, id love to know the percentages but its probably fruitless.
Falcons had/have their issues also, but sold only here and NZ its a drop in the ocean compared to what Hyundai/Kia sell worldwide.
How many happy owners of either brand would there be worldwide where they've had no issues, they also generally dont speak up about it either! This not only applies to those to brands, but any brand.

roKWiz · 24-12-2023, 02:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DJM83

How many have failed vs how many they have made, id love to know the percentages but its probably fruitless.
Falcons had/have their issues also, but sold only here and NZ its a drop in the ocean compared to what Hyundai/Kia sell worldwide.
How many happy owners of either brand would there be worldwide where they've had no issues, they also generally dont speak up about it either! This not only applies to those to brands, but any brand.

Isn't there a 3 + million Hyundai recall out at the moment on them being a fire hazzard ?

Franco Cozzo · 24-12-2023, 02:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by smoo

If you read the link it appears this goes beyond neglectful owners.
The same thing has happened in the US.

https://topclassactions.com/lawsuit-...on-settlement/

But more the point. We have another bent journo who confesses himself as impartial and honest but his bias is so obvious he hasn’t even touched on an issue that potentially affects a huge amount of new car buyers.

Australian automotive 'journalists' are the original charlatans, before the infection spread to all the others too, everyone is too busy putting their own spin on things rather than reporting the facts.

At least I only do it for fun, not money

naddis01 · 24-12-2023, 03:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kypez

Sadly, the Raptor is the closest thing now but at a huge price premium over a F6! And I don't understand what people like in the engine note of the Raptor... I hate it. But again, the only option. The F6 sounded, to my ears, much nicer.

A manual Raptor would be awesome in the world we live in now

That FG F6 was around $60k when it came out in 2008 which is about $90k in today's money or roughly what a Raptor costs.

**kypez** · 24-12-2023, 03:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by naddis01

That FG F6 was around $60k when it came out in 2008 which is about $90k in today's money or roughly what a Raptor costs.

Sprint was $60k in 2016 so don't have to adjust that far. 2014 F6 was still under $60k

naddis01 · 24-12-2023, 03:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kypez

Sprint was $60k in 2016 so don't have to adjust that far. 2014 F6 was still under $60k

Who's to say the Raptor won't still be in the low 90s in another 6 or 7 years at the end of it's cycle

**kypez** · 24-12-2023, 03:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by naddis01

Who's to say the Raptor won't still be in the low 90s in another 6 or 7 years at the end of it's cycle

Because they've had price creep galore with the Rangers. Given this is probably the last ICE version (hence the reuse of the T6 platform), I'd suggest they'll keep their demand as people go kicking and screaming to EVs.

naddis01 · 24-12-2023, 03:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kypez

Because they've had price creep galore with the Rangers. Given this is probably the last ICE version (hence the reuse of the T6 platform), I'd suggest they'll keep their demand as people go kicking and screaming to EVs.

Ok mate.

**kypez** · 24-12-2023, 03:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by naddis01

Ok mate.

Noticed your display picture so I guess you're a fan of the Raptor or owner. Didn't want to upset you. I've got one on order. Not a fan but nothing else in the class that can do what it does for the price.

ToryMikey · 24-12-2023, 03:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by naddis01

That FG F6 was around $60k when it came out in 2008 which is about $90k in today's money or roughly what a Raptor costs.

That’s disingenuous and you know it.

FGX XR6 Turbo ute was $39810 in 2014 when released. That’s $47,776 today. That only buys you a base Ranger these days. Won’t even get you 4x4. Quite far off what a Raptor costs, even if you think a Raptor is as good as an XR6T ute, which it clearly isn’t in all aspects except off-road prowess and extension factor.

**PG2** · 24-12-2023, 04:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ToryMikey

That’s disingenuous and you know it.

FGX XR6 Turbo ute was $39810 in 2014 when released. That’s $47,776 today. That only buys you a base Ranger these days. Won’t even get you 4x4. Quite far off what a Raptor costs, even if you think a Raptor is as good as an XR6T ute, which it clearly isn’t in all aspects except off-road prowess and extension factor.

Whether you think that a XR6T ute is better than a Raptor or not, is your opinion. There are plenty of people out there that think a Raptor is better than a XR6T ute.

As for 'extension factor' you could say the same thing about a XR6T, or any sort of performance car for that matter.

To be fair, the Raptor has many more features than what a XR6T had. You may not want those features yourself, but they are there nonetheless.

Keep in mind, the FG X (all models) was actually cheaper than the B-series. A FG X should have been much dearer than what it actually was but very few people were buying them by this stage. The FG X was not at all profitable.

I am not bagging Falcons, in fact, I still own four of them, two sedans, one wagon and one ute and I love them. If they were still available to buy I would own a brand new one.

naddis01 · 24-12-2023, 04:04 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ToryMikey

That’s disingenuous and you know it.

FGX XR6 Turbo ute was $39810 in 2014 when released. That’s $47,776 today. That only buys you a base Ranger these days. Won’t even get you 4x4. Quite far off what a Raptor costs, even if you think a Raptor is as good as an XR6T ute, which it clearly isn’t in all aspects except off-road prowess and extension factor.

So I can't compare an FPV product with a Ford Performance product, especially with the post I quoted? I was just trying to give some perspective.

In respect to the example you've given, how did that pricing work out for the Falcon? Obviously it wasn't sustainable.

Can you post a pic of your FGX mate?

**DJM83** · 24-12-2023, 04:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by roKWiz

Isn't there a 3 + million Hyundai recall out at the moment on them being a fire hazzard ?

And Ford AU never had recalls with falcons?
Its all relative, the more cars you sell, the more that are going to have issues with recalls.

Quote:

Originally Posted by naddis01

Can you post a pic of your FGX mate?

Probably never purchased a new Australian Ford to begin with so a part of the problem of where we are now! And now doesnt want to as some models are thin on the ground and doesnt want to pay.

A Raptor will do almost everything an XR6T ute will do and then some, and they as quick if not quicker i can assure you that!

roKWiz · 24-12-2023, 04:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DJM83

And Ford AU never had recalls with falcons?
Its all relative, the more cars you sell, the more that are going to have issues with recalls.

Think it was with Kia.
Merely stating what I read recently wasn't personal about Hyundai vs Ford.

**DJM83** · 24-12-2023, 04:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by roKWiz

Think it was with Kia.
Merely stating what I read recently wasn't personal about Hyundai vs Ford.

Soz my bad read that wrong, apologies.

ToryMikey · 24-12-2023, 05:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DJM83

Probably never purchased a new Australian Ford to begin with so a part of the problem of where we are now! And now doesnt want to as some models are thin on the ground and doesnt want to pay.

A Raptor will do almost everything an XR6T ute will do and then some, and they as quick if not quicker i can assure you that!

I was 22 when production stopped, not really sure how many 22 year olds could afford a brand new car of any description, let alone a performance car.

As for your other comment, if I reach my savings goals I plan on buying the best manual example possible in early 2025, you’re right they aren’t cheap and they’re thin on the ground - which is exactly why I need to delay my gratification! Two manuals in all of Victoria right now after all.

**DJM83** · 24-12-2023, 05:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ToryMikey

I was 22 when production stopped, not really sure how many 22 year olds could afford a brand new car of any description, let alone a performance car.

As for your other comment, if I reach my savings goals I plan on buying the best manual example possible in early 2025, you’re right they aren’t cheap and they’re thin on the ground - which is exactly why I need to delay my gratification! Two manuals in all of Victoria right now after all.

Plenty have at that age (myself included)

I wish you the best buying one, thin on the ground/flogged/highly modded. May aswell buy a raptor.
As much as this thread is just slagging off imports, i appreciate you striving to get what you want! No mines not for sale, although i have considered it.

End of the day, theres no point dwelling on what we have now compared to what we had. It is what it is, move on and buy, if you can what you want!

Itsme · 24-12-2023, 05:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kevino

It is interesting that no one so far disagrees.

Simon decided against sharing his Ranger loyalist views.

I agree with you too although the last oz made car I drove was a VZ rental and that was disapointing.

But I did drive my mates 2008 FG a few years back briefly impressed with the power and acceleration but the seating and ergonomics was disappointing.

My last falcon ute was FG XR6 model, no doubt a very nice ride and sorry to see it go as I traded up to a Ranger Dual cab. Did I have any regrets in doing this? " Hell no" best thing I ever did.
The ranger has exceeded all my expectations which does an excellent job where the falcon cannot.

I suppose it all comes down to as what you want to do with your vehicle, my next vehicle unfortunately will not be a ford at all, but if I were to change my mind it would certainly be a Raptor.

PooDog · 24-12-2023, 06:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ToryMikey

I was 22 when production stopped, not really sure how many 22 year olds could afford a brand new car of any description, let alone a performance car.

As for your other comment, if I reach my savings goals I plan on buying the best manual example possible in early 2025, you’re right they aren’t cheap and they’re thin on the ground - which is exactly why I need to delay my gratification! Two manuals in all of Victoria right now after all.

If it were me I would be buying now if that's what you want as the goal posts might not stay where you think they will be .....25 is a wee ways away , it could be like waiting for house prices to drop ?

Sprintey · 24-12-2023, 06:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ToryMikey

I feel you. Local manufacturing shut when I was 22, too early in my life to afford a new car. The XR6T manual ute I wanted to drive off the lot wasn’t still being made by the time I could afford a new car. Now what ute can you buy for the same price, a Ranger XL 4x4? Feel the excitement!

I can relate to this comment. I remember being 27, yet to buy a new car and looking at a blueprint AUIII XR8 on runout and wanting it badly (the red forte wagon appealed too!). Had to wait until 32 to buy 1st new car, in cash. Generally family came first and having kids young, working hard and saving pennies and putting them to work meant to delay in my situation.

Many others can buy a new car pretty much soon after 18 either on debt or if they are lucky, in cash. Everyone will approach it differently.

Keep going for your goal ToryMikey - start watching extra close now to see if it falls into your range faster, given the effect of the recent interest rate rises.

Sprintey · 24-12-2023, 06:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by lra

After reading these comments about current utes, it seems that a double cab ute with a lower ride height, V8, 6 speed manual or auto, disc brakes all round, a payload of about 700kg, room for a standard pallet in the tray, and possibly 3 passengers squeezed into the rear seat would be welcome.
Do I have a deal for yoouuu ! !

A Holden Crewman ! Ooops, forgot, they are nearly 20 years old.

Bro had an SS Crewman new, the leaking from the upper window seals in heavy rain was even more than the standard VY, and that's saying something. Cool car tho.

PooDog · 24-12-2023, 06:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sprintey

I can relate to this comment. I remember being 27, yet to buy a new car and looking at a blueprint AUIII XR8 on runout and wanting it badly (the red forte wagon appealed too!). Had to wait until 32 to buy 1st new car, in cash. Generally family came first and having kids young, working hard and saving pennies and putting them to work meant to delay in my situation.

Many others can buy a new car pretty much soon after 18 either on debt or if they are lucky, in cash. Everyone will approach it differently.

Keep going for your goal ToryMikey - start watching extra close now to see if it falls into your range faster, given the effect of the recent interest rate rises.

Trouble is they don't make them anymore, ..... he's got some toys in his list he could flick ?

Sprintey · 24-12-2023, 06:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Franco Cozzo

Australian automotive 'journalists' are the original charlatans, before the infection spread to all the others too, everyone is too busy putting their own spin on things rather than reporting the facts.

At least I only do it for fun, not money

That's the best way to do it! It would be fun to do 'AFF reviews:' threads where absolute honesty rules, and funny turns of phrase are encouraged.

Sprintey · 24-12-2023, 06:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by PooDog

Trouble is they don't make them anymore, ..... he's got some toys in his list he could flick ?

Ah as I understood it he's looking for a late model low kms, last Falcon manual XR6 Turbo? They will appear in the used market for years to come.

ToryMikey · 24-12-2023, 06:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sprintey

I can relate to this comment. I remember being 27, yet to buy a new car and looking at a blueprint AUIII XR8 on runout and wanting it badly (the red forte wagon appealed too!). Had to wait until 32 to buy 1st new car, in cash. Generally family came first and having kids young, working hard and saving pennies and putting them to work meant to delay in my situation.

Many others can buy a new car pretty much soon after 18 either on debt or if they are lucky, in cash. Everyone will approach it differently.

Keep going for your goal ToryMikey - start watching extra close now to see if it falls into your range faster, given the effect of the recent interest rate rises.

I don't have kids yet but I do own and run a business purchased at age 25. Those related loans will mature in Jan 2025 freeing up effectively $12k per month cash flow that I didn't have before. As such it makes a bit more sense to wait until then to purchase, no matter which way the market moves. I'm looking for a 2015 or 2016, I've already got my older cars sorted. That said, if a nice Windsor equipped E Series rocks up, I might be tempted...

I will most likely sell the E36, that's mainly kept for sentimental reasons as it was the first car I ever bought but I don't drive it, it's not registered at the moment, it's clean and a beautiful shape but so slow. The only thing that may change my mind is if a SOHC Falcon motor fits...they do make 340i badges after all!

As for the rate rises, I am lucky enough to own my home outright which negates the effects (the aforementioned business loans are 100% fixed). However I know almost everyone is affected by them, my own brother purchased his home in 2021, fixed at 2%, jumped up to 6% in April this year, now pays $400+ per week more on his mortgage, hence he moved back in with Mum and Dad. Can't blame him really. I can blame him for buying a brand new 3 Series at 12% p/a though.

kevino · 24-12-2023, 06:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ToryMikey

I don't have kids yet but I do own and run a business purchased at age 25. Those related loans will mature in Jan 2025 freeing up effectively $12k per month cash flow that I didn't have before. As such it makes a bit more sense to wait until then to purchase, no matter which way the market moves. I'm looking for a 2015 or 2016, I've already got my older cars sorted. That said, if a nice Windsor equipped E Series rocks up, I might be tempted...

I will most likely sell the E36, that's mainly kept for sentimental reasons as it was the first car I ever bought but I don't drive it, it's not registered at the moment, it's clean and a beautiful shape but so slow. The only thing that may change my mind is if a SOHC Falcon motor fits...they do make 340i badges after all!

As for the rate rises, I am lucky enough to own my home outright which negates the effects (the aforementioned business loans are 100% fixed). However I know almost everyone is affected by them, my own brother purchased his home in 2021, fixed at 2%, jumped up to 6% in April this year, now pays $400+ per week more on his mortgage, hence he moved back in with Mum and Dad. Can't blame him really. I can blame him for buying a brand new 3 Series at 12% p/a though.

If the Skoda had a manual box reckon you wouldn’t hanker got these older manual cars
Dsg is nice but manual is nicer
Of course no manual Skoda s sold nowadays in Oz anyway

ToryMikey · 24-12-2023, 06:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kevino

If the Skoda had a manual box reckon you wouldn’t hanker got these older manual cars
Dsg is nice but manual is nicer
Of course no manual Skoda s sold nowadays in Oz anyway

If it were available in manual, I would have got it in manual of course

Hence why my XH will never be sold ever!

Edit: I do have a T5 and other associated goodies ready to go into the EL sedan as well...

Sprintey · 24-12-2023, 08:44 PM

Good man ToryMikey, you're all over it. Happy hunting when the time comes!
Re: the E series Windsor, & given the user name, if you get a go at a manual ED Sprint, give it a go! From 3000 revs up...

PooDog · 24-12-2023, 08:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sprintey

Ah as I understood it he's looking for a late model low kms, last Falcon manual XR6 Turbo? They will appear in the used market for years to come.

Anything manual is like rocking horse sh#t over here ....oh well good luck to him

Ben73 · 25-12-2023, 05:10 AM

Yeah I don’t understand the new trend of buying 4x4 utes as family cars to drive around town and do nothing else with.

Sure my Ranger was good for what it was, but it’s the worst daily I’ve owned. Even though I used it’s tray and off road capabilities I ended up finding work arounds and buying 4x4 wagons instead.
I wouldn’t even buy a 4x4 anymore if I didn’t use its capabilities. They’re very boring to drive around town.