The Age: End of the road nears for Falcon - Page 8

eb2fairmont · 13-01-2010, 02:01 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Falc'man

The reward for Ford Australia building the best RWD (for the budget) is - as we've already seen, them getting the T6 - will be them getting preference in developing the GRWD... which WILL happen.

!

Absolutely spot on

Windsor220 · 13-01-2010, 02:01 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by greenfoam

The only thing for sure is if Ford AU don't come out this morning and say, The Falcon is staying 100%, this story allready has enough momentum in the public and media to end the Falcon in Mitsubishi style. You have to be very careful to not let rumours get out of control when the public and hence media are 65+% Holden and such a rivalry has been nourished and let exsist over the years by both camps. That kind of thing can easily bite you on the *** if/when it gets too one sided

I agree.
It seems something said has spiralled out of control and almost destroyed any chance Ford has of going forward all in one day. If people think Ford is shutting down they wont go near the place. Mitsubishi part 2.

Riggers1973 · 13-01-2010, 02:05 AM

kcuf front wheel drive cars! Might have to defect and send a message!

Breaks my heart to say that! :-(

UKXR8 · 13-01-2010, 02:09 AM

If this is true (and I really hope it isn't) then surely it must be time to let FoA know that we don't want this to happen.
The Falcon is an icon.
Everybody remembers what damage was done to Ford when they dropped the V8 back in the 80's. This would be far worse, you can't simply rebadge a Mondeo, Taurus or whatever as a Falcon and expect people to swallow it.
Your average Falcon driver is far more discerning than people on here give them credit for, otherwise the Falcon would have died long ago.
It has been said that people will eventually accept a FWD large car, but that has already been tried with the Taurus and the answer was stick it where the sun doesn't shine, Mitsubishi tried it as well, again fail.
We need some kind of campaign to let Ford know how much we want to retain the Falcon.

"Falcons Forever" anybody??

vztrt · 13-01-2010, 02:18 AM

Just to bring another thing up, Ford had a survey about a year ago asking people if RWD was important. I seem to remember that there was a majority that people wanted a RWD car (could someone confirm). Now if people want RWD why would they want to change it?

eb2fairmont · 13-01-2010, 02:21 AM

Because FWD is cheaper to manufacture.

Also looking at UKxr8's post I think Aurion is suitable for that list too

Riggers1973 · 13-01-2010, 02:35 AM

Facebook has a page: Save the Falcon

Join and tell ya mates!

UKXR8 · 13-01-2010, 02:42 AM

Done, there are 2 groups on there, I joined both...

mikmak · 13-01-2010, 02:59 AM

So how long until some one goes down to Geelong to sort this out. Anyone? (I'm in QLD so no luck there, but I can post a Gray-Nicholls).

FPV GTHO · 13-01-2010, 04:21 AM

Nissan Maxima - Nissan Skyline/Infiniti G37

Toyota Camry - Toyota Aristo/Lexus GS.

Ford Taurus - Ford Falcon/Lincoln MKx?

The Yeti · 13-01-2010, 06:57 AM

I feel alot better now with my desigion to place an order with holden for my new company car I was havign issues as I have always been a ford man but I figure my deisers have always been falcon / fairlane based, the fairlane left the line up some time ago and now the falcon as we now it is on its way out, Hold on Holden here I come

P6LTD351 · 13-01-2010, 08:13 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by The Yeti

I feel alot better now with my desigion to place an order with holden for my new company car I was havign issues as I have always been a ford man but I figure my deisers have always been falcon / fairlane based, the fairlane left the line up some time ago and now the falcon as we now it is on its way out, Hold on Holden here I come

yeah whatever ya reckon

HSE2 · 13-01-2010, 08:50 AM

Right now the reality is that Ford US would love this platform to be what we don't and to arrive at a different conclusion for such a small market is indeed a momentous task. One Ford demonstrates that possibility still remains.

Peoples voices should be heard on possible scenarios and the voice should be clear. Ford is putting this topic out there. They want debate on this otherwise they would have handled these questions and topics differently.

Once the hysteria and media inaccuracy pass, there is a reality that has always been there underpinning this issue. Ford want local government on their door asking what this means for respective industries.

Yesterdays announcements saw no change in a decision that is still pending. Nothing said is confirmation of what people fear but the sensationalism isn't exactly a bad thing either if it spells out clearly what people think.

Right now it’s not accurate or a fair refection on what has actually been said, maybe not even a fair representation of what is implied, but now the debate has shifted from the accuracy of what has been said to the implied consequences of a worse case situation. There is nothing wrong with that as its just as likely to be the outcome given there will be no sentiment entered into.

Make no mistake; it’s not the media that have read this completely wrong. People in the position of the Ford employees quoted aren't amateurs. They know what this subject will do in Australia and they keep bringing it up in a way that questions the future in a challenge to essentially, our manhood. It is by design and as such, they will get what they asked for.
You have GM saying Ford are extreme with their views on RWD, and the penalty that imposes. They say they have alternatives that can negate the FWD economy argument on a RWD platform. These statements from GM came nearly at the same time Ford are supporting the different notion.

Outrage at this notion, opening the door for Government funding to fight for retention, right now is a by- product of sensationalism, but they aren't entirely misplaced or misguided.
The way I see it we can argue between ourselves on the accuracy of what has been said or interpreted by the media or we can take it at face value and contribute accordingly if such a situation should evolve. Obviously if the result is favourable there in no harm and no discussion to be had but what if?

There is no hysteria from me. Ford will have a business case to make. I understand and accept that.

I will continue to buy large RWD cars until I can't or they aren't offered.

In the past I have supported European imports but have now realised that the money is better spent with local manufacturing and it’s no real penalty to me in terms of the product.

When that equation changes, if the configuration changes my priorities will be to support the local that remains assembled in this country and RWD. I would only consider an importation if there was no local content offering a solution catering to my bias. Drive configuration first, country of support second.

I have a strong blue preference but I have a stronger Green and Yellow one.
Looking past the commentary the question remains what is most likely to happen and what is Fords idea of the ideal solution?

I am not going to get upset or rant about something I can’t control. What I can do is make my intentions on the subject crystal clear. I have received two surveys in the last 6 months from Ford regarding this issue. The answer both times was the same. It will be the same tomorrow and the next day and the day after that. My business decisions will be the same as Fords.

The reality is that a decision has to be made and the outcome is unlikely to be exactly what we have right now. That will mean a compromise. The benefits in terms of product of global proportions are undeniable. It’s the message Ford want us to hear very clearly. The unanswered question is, but at what cost?

I don’t personally think Ford really care for Australia at all. Sure they respect the product and the engineering. On every visit they claim our product is essentially one of the best in the Ford world but suggest there is no business case for it under one Ford. That translates to we aren't really interested in giving the world the best Ford products unless it’s cost effective. The business has to be profitable after all. That’s the bottom line.

4Vman · 13-01-2010, 09:06 AM

One thing i think is becoming clear about the future of the Falcon, if people don't start voting with their wallets Ford will vote with theirs....

Joe5619 · 13-01-2010, 09:17 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by The Yeti

I feel alot better now with my desigion to place an order with holden for my new company car I was havign issues as I have always been a ford man but I figure my deisers have always been falcon / fairlane based, the fairlane left the line up some time ago and now the falcon as we now it is on its way out, Hold on Holden here I come

Off you go & buy a car inferior in every way, just because the Falcon "may" be different in 5 years time!! Sounds like a dumb decision to me!!

Wretched · 13-01-2010, 09:24 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 4Vman

One thing i think is becoming clear about the future of the Falcon, if people don't start voting with their wallets Ford will vote with theirs....

EXACTLY.
How many on here keep rambling on about how good the Falcon is and Ford should continue it, etc yet don't open their wallets to get a new one?
Too many here await a "second hand" one.

Well if you're so concerned about the Falcon (whether you believe the hype or not) why don't you all put your money where your mouth is and go and purchase one, a new FG?

TC200six · 13-01-2010, 10:03 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Windsor220

Well yep the story is getting around. Just on the 7pm project.
Hughesy "We cant let the Falcon die"
Carrie "Its not the best looking car is it?"
Some guy I cant remember his name "Im a Holden man, get rid of it"

What a stupid show that "7pm project" is. Having seen so many stupid silly infantile promos for it on Ten makes me wonder why people watch that crap show, other than dumb narrow-minded gen Y youths who can't stand to watch Ten's normal news bulletins for being too boring for them. In response to someone saying "We can't let '7pm Project' die!", someone else says "It's not the best way of entertainment, nor is it funny isn't it?" and I say "It's pointless show, get rid of it now bi...!!!"

Joe5619 · 13-01-2010, 10:14 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Wretched

Well if you're so concerned about the Falcon (whether you believe the hype or not) why don't you all put your money where your mouth is and go and purchase one, a new FG?

I did in Dec09!! And I'm already saving up for it's replacement.

Cobra · 13-01-2010, 10:33 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by The Yeti

I feel alot better now with my desigion to place an order with holden for my new company car I was havign issues as I have always been a ford man but I figure my deisers have always been falcon / fairlane based, the fairlane left the line up some time ago and now the falcon as we now it is on its way out, Hold on Holden here I come

Off you pop then! By the way, you'll fit in with all the illiterate bogans who can't spell and don't know what punctuation is.

Wally · 13-01-2010, 10:35 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Falc'man

Why can't you show a little respect and restraint like all the other pro-Holden members of this forum?

That's the spirit, olive branch in one hand and a hatchet in the other. What's wrong son, things not going as planned. It must be frustrating for you for the chief not to have included you in his circle of influence..... how dare he ignore you. LOL

I don't know why you have to resort to labelling me as pro Holden, when I'm not. Fact is I have probably had more Fords from the showroom than you ever will. You are confusing my not suffering fools and translating that into anti Ford bias; you really must learn this is an analogue world, not binary.

On topic:- I see even Dick Johnson is being frustrated in his attempts to get clarification, according to a Courier Mail half page spread devoted to the announcement.

burnz · 13-01-2010, 10:39 AM

this could all be a "purple monkey dishwasher" stuffup.

**Fordman1** · 13-01-2010, 10:44 AM

Today's Herald Sun has a positive spin on this all:

Car-maker lays out One Ford global road map: Falcon a Model Car"

Gover says:

"The legendary Ford Mustang will be twinned with Australia's own Ford Falcon in a plan to take the Braodmeadows brand beyond 2015.

Speaking at the Detoit Motor Show, Ford's worldwide president, Alan Mullaly, said there would be a continued role for the Falcon in Australia within a global plan.

'We have leaned so much from the Falcon because it's a dynamite car. Whatever that Falcon morphs to, for the next one, it will be available for every-one around the world.

We're going to have a large sedan. The whole thing about RWD ? We're going to have a RWD car, and we've got the Mustang. So, you can imagine that there will be a next version of the Falcon that will be even better. In capital letters.' ".

I don't see what the panic is... the media have twisted this everyway.

I think Gover is right.....

The Snout · 13-01-2010, 10:50 AM

^ Actually sounds like good news, taking Falcon global. Seems to confirm there is a future beyond 2015.

Just depends on "Whatever that Falcon morphs to" ends up meaning.

chevypower · 13-01-2010, 10:52 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Wally

That's the spirit, olive branch in one hand and a hatchet in the other. What's wrong son, things not going as planned. It must be frustrating for you for the chief not to have included you in his circle of influence..... how dare he ignore you. LOL

I don't know why you have to resort to labelling me as pro Holden, when I'm not. Fact is I have probably had more Fords from the showroom than you ever will. You are confusing my not suffering fools and translating that into anti Ford bias; you really must learn this is an analogue world, not binary.

He just asked you to have a little restraint... Nope I don't think that was an example of restraint.

Restraint: "Control or repression of feelings; constraint."

chevypower · 13-01-2010, 10:59 AM

Good post BarraXR8

Quote:

Originally Posted by The Snout

^ Actually sounds like good news, taking Falcon global. Seems to confirm there is a future beyond 2015.

Just depends on "Whatever that Falcon morphs to" ends up meaning.

It's probably true, the Falcon as it's known will come to an end, but that doesn't mean there won't be a new Global RWD sedan with all the goodies from the Falcon. And goodies from elsewhere in Ford too. I think the I-6 will be gone - that's a given. I hope a GRWD does happen, and I hope it looks a little like the Interceptor concept. If it doesn't happen, the Taurus AWD is an excellent car, and looks fantastic - but I don't think it will be just a Taurus, i think as has been said, there will be morphing all around. I think a mid-size car will take over the Mondeo and Fusion, and there will be a Taurus sized car or slightly smaller, and the GRWD might be actually bigger than the Falcon. At least slightly wider. Just some of my early thoughts.

Brazen · 13-01-2010, 11:00 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Barraxr8

Today's Herald Sun has a positive spin on this all:

Car-maker lays out One Ford global road map: Falcon a Model Car"

Gover says:

"The legendary Ford Mustang will be twinned with Australia's own Ford Falcon in a plan to take the Braodmeadows brand beyond 2015.

Speaking at the Detoit Motor Show, Ford's worldwide president, Alan Mullaly, said there would be a continued role for the Falcon in Australia within a global plan.

'We have leaned so much from the Falcon because it's a dynamite car. Whatever that Falcon morphs to, for the next one, it will be available for every-one around the world.

We're going to have a large sedan. The whole thing about RWD ? We're going to have a RWD car, and we've got the Mustang. So, you can imagine that there will be a next version of the Falcon that will be even better. In capital letters.' ".

I don't see what the panic is... the media have twisted this everyway.

I think Gover is right.....

The media are just doing their job.

Ford says that individual cars for countries will cease (ie Falcon).
Ford says only the Mustang will be quarantined (Falcon not mentioned).
Ford have said that global tastes are aligning.
Ford have said that they must have more global cars.
Ford AU have not confirmed development of the next Falcon.
Ford AU have not confirmed continuing production in Australia.
Ford AU cancelled the Focus investment in Australia.
Ford AU have been canning variants.
Ford AU have said that FWD can be an effective package.
Ford AU have said that people dont care as much about RWD nowadays.
Ford AU have never publicly touted the performance benefits of RWD.
Ford AU have said RWD is only good for towing but these customers are buying 4WDs.
The current platform has been developed for years around a long cast iron inline 6 which requires very specific proportions, this platform would be too compromised to suit any other car.
There is no word of any future RWD platform being developed.

These stories are Ford's fault, not the media.

Chilliman · 13-01-2010, 11:04 AM

PAUL GOVER on SUNRISE reporting from Detriot:

Reports of Falcons demise 150% incorrect
Current Falcon guaranteed until 2015
Falcon to be twinned with Mustang from 2015
From 2015 less local content but still made in Australia

Brazen · 13-01-2010, 11:07 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chilliman

PAUL GOVER on SUNRISE reporting from Detriot:

Reports of Falcons demise 150% incorrect
Current Falcon guaranteed until 2015
Falcon to be twinned with Mustang from 2015
From 2015 less local content but still made in Australia

If this is true, then this is outstanding.

Exact copy of Holden developing the Camaro from the Commodore.

Local production concerned me the most. I would rather have a FWD/AWD Falcon made in Australia than nothing at all.

Ford have to really work out the message they are sending, they seem to be their own worse enemy with all the doubts they create.

chevypower · 13-01-2010, 11:08 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Brazen

The media are just doing their job.....
These stories are Ford's fault, not the media.

Please tell me you are kidding! Facts: Ford is consolidating its products in to a global vehicle lineup, and will no longer have different vehicles for different countries. Media twist: "End of the road nears for Falcon" - not even a maybe. It was written as a definite. Sorry, but the The Age sucks for not writing with any tact.

**cs123** · 13-01-2010, 11:10 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chilliman

PAUL GOVER on SUNRISE reporting from Detriot:

Reports of Falcons demise 150% incorrect
Current Falcon guaranteed until 2015
Falcon to be twinned with Mustang from 2015
From 2015 less local content but still made in Australia

Yup saw that too. Looked to be almost a "paid" spot trying to fix a PR problem. Everyone singing off the same hymn sheet, Gover, presenters.