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#151 | |||
FF.Com.Au Hardcore
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: Victoria
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Snicko, heatspot and all the new slo-mo replays are used by the commentary team to microscope every decision by the umpires. If the umpires have sole control of the decisions, why are they the only ones who can't use this technology to help them??
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#152 | |||
IWCMOGTVM Club Supporter
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#153 | |||
Regular Schmuck
Join Date: Dec 2004
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#154 | |||
Regular Schmuck
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#155 | |||
FF.Com.Au Hardcore
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#156 | |||
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Mind you I am not taking away from Haddins achievement as it was a good knock by him.
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#157 | |||
Regular Schmuck
Join Date: Dec 2004
Posts: 5,640
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Technology isn't used to judge LBW decisions and at the moment there are no plans to do so, but I'm wrong. Noticed how long it takes to get a hotspot or snicko on the broadcast? Several minutes. Each. Ever watched cricket played in other countries? Most of them do not currently employ this technology. Have you noticed how many close run-out and stumping decisions are referred to the 3rd umpire? Virtually all of them. Ever watched a match played in India? Noticed how many close LBW decisions that players appeal for? Judging a run-out takes a couple of minutes and there are are fraction of those appeals compared to LBW appeals. Anything close would be referred to the 3rd umpire just as run-outs are due to the fact that the umpire would be crucified if he gave an appeal out that didn't satisfy the laws and visa versa. If the speed of the resources are increased immesurably and they're constant over all test playing nations *then* you would have a case. |
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#158 | |||
Regular Schmuck
Join Date: Dec 2004
Posts: 5,640
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Only a handful of MoM's have been given to the player of the losing side and only in cases where his performance was far and above that of any other player on the field. In this instance, I don't believe Elliot should have gotten it over Haddin but had the Aussie team's scoresheet had the runmakers spread their runs more evenly and Elliot gave NZ a shot at a win then I would have sided with you in giving Elliot the MoM award. |
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#159 | ||
FF.Com.Au Hardcore
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: Miranda, NSW
Posts: 6,771
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I think the NZ team are starting to show some real class in their fielding...the first one dayer against Australia was an example of that....Unseen since the days of Jeremy Coney/Jeff Crowe in the mid 80's.
With good batsmen like Elliott and McCullum and a great captain in Vettori I can see this NZ side being a contender for the No 1 position in 50 over cricket real soon especially as Australia are now in a position of having to rebuild since losing Warne, Hayden & McGrath. So in answer to the thread question...The golden era is over although the fact NZ are on the improve probably overshadows it a bit
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#160 | |||
FF.Com.Au Hardcore
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: Victoria
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It was the end of last year when the referral system was used in a test match between the windies and NZ and currently in the test between the Windies and the poms. All forms of available technology were used for any decision that was referred. Lots of LBWs were overturned thanks to hawkeye and while everyone may not agree with it, you can't argue with it. *You* can try tho....
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#161 | |||
Regular Schmuck
Join Date: Dec 2004
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Even the executive producer of Nine (which develop most of this technology for broadcast use only) suggest that the only reasonally foolproof technology is hotspot... and even then I've seen situations where video replays couldn't pick up the right angle to confirm a hotspot. |
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#162 | |||
moderator ford coupe club
Join Date: Jun 2007
Posts: 6,640
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it can be looked at, that haddin's effort won the match while elliot's did not |
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#163 | ||
Rob
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: Woodcroft S.A.
Posts: 21,548
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wasn't m.clarke MoM in game 2, which australia lost.
regarding the lbw decisions being left up to the umpire, i would agree but... there does seem to be more and more incidences these days where the replay will show a bit of bat involved first. sometimes embarressingly so for the umpire. this fact alone says that somethng needs to be done in this area, whether the umps are wired up to a 3rd/4th ump or a challenge system but its happening far to regularly now. mccullum in perth, fergusson and taylor in sydney etc. maybe they aren't becoming more common. maybe the scrutiny is becoming more. either way, the fans want to see the right decisions so even though the purists and cricket officials don't want to slow the games down anymore than they have to, they will eventually be forced to look at these sort of issues. there is a lot of money/betting invloved these days too which is why these challenge systems are coming in. speaking of the challenge system, england and west indies are using it at the moment. one of the challenges made by west indies was against an lbw on sarwan i think. umpire gave it out, challenged, and given not out. incidently hawkeye said it was going on to hit leg stump. go figure. |
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#164 | |||||
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#165 | ||
Rob
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: Woodcroft S.A.
Posts: 21,548
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hopefully its a decent game tomorrow. i'll be there. forecast is a nice 23 too. woot.
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#166 | |||
FF.Com.Au Hardcore
Join Date: Jun 2006
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I'm still going with " if the technology is there, use it!' Was good to see that no technology could save the poms tho!
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#167 | |||
Regular Schmuck
Join Date: Dec 2004
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As far as LBW decisions go, I don't trust snicko, I don't trust Hawkeye (and neither does the executive producer of 9). I would trust hotspot to judge as to whether the ball has hit the bat and I would trust the line drawn down the middle of the pitch to judge pitch outside leg and hit in line. That's about it. Given that, the best tool to judge whether the ball would have gone onto the stumps IMO is the umpire at the bowler's end. The technology today has still proven to be unreliable and not the be all end all. I've lost count of how many catches have been given not out because it was unclear as to whether the ball had been grassed even though the fieldsman is absolutely adamant they've taken it fairly. Hawkeye providing ridiculous estimations of ball prediction. IIRC, the daddy of Hawkeye suggested an error of margin of 10cm at one stage but I can't find it recorded anywhere (and that's without predicting the flight). Snicko being sensetive enough to pick up creaks and stresses in the bat and handle, masking itself as a faint edge. Run-outs effected can also go towards the batsmen as the critical moment just happens to be between two frames or the spigot leaving the groove isn't completely clear due to the bails being a blur or the batsmen has moved ~10cm between frames and it's unclear as to whether they've made their ground or not. If the technology was fast and accurate, I'd be on your side. It's not so I'm not. |
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#168 | |||
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#169 | |||
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To use on of your favourite sayings: " I don't trust him as far as I can throw him!" That goes for both of your oponions on technology in cricket too!
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#170 | |||
Regular Schmuck
Join Date: Dec 2004
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Unless you're part of the team that has anything to do with these tools, I'd take his opinion over yours. So, are you in any way involved with any of the tools the 9 commentary team use? |
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#171 | |||
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#172 | |||
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Join Date: Jun 2006
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Also, I don't know any of the tools on the commentary team. I do however now of another... ![]() ![]()
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#173 | |||
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Clinging as it's all I've got? Geez, I listed at least 6 points and explained why I don't feel they're feasable. Your comeback is to pick one sentence out of a post and run with it. Not much point debating anything else with you. Last edited by Rodp; 10-02-2009 at 12:30 AM. |
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#174 | |||
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The ICC is allowing this technology to be used in matches. I don't think they care about what you and you buddy at channel 9 think. Not too many years ago, Tv replays weren't used on tight run-outs. Now, as you point out, they are referred to all the time by umpires. Maybe too often you said. But why? Because its there to use now. Better be safe that look foolish is what most umpires probably think. I think its a good thing. Like I said before, why is the umpire the only one watching the game, still unsure if he just got a split-second decision wrong, when he can refer it, get the correct decision and avoid embarrassment and controversy. I will admit that its going to be difficult to introduce the referral system. Might take a while to get used to and to get it right for that matter. If they use it for cricket like they do in rugby league would be a good starting point in my oponion. Make it so the technology must 100% prove that the umpire got it wrong to change a decision or in the case of uncertainty, refer it back for a umpires call. Have you watched any games where this new technology is used, or are you, once again I might add, just going off what you've read and heard??
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#175 | ||
Powered by Ford
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: Where the beers cold
Posts: 2,349
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Well the way i see it is we have the technology too make the right decision so lets use it, if we lose abit more time over a right decision so be it, LBW's just seem to be the one dismissal that is hurting the game.
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#176 | |||||||
Regular Schmuck
Join Date: Dec 2004
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I've stated my opinion on why some of the technology is prone to error, of course I can't offer proof that will in any way sway your opinion because you seem to believe that technology is infallable in decision making even though there are multitudes of examples where it's failed. Quote:
Given the framerate of broadcast cricket, a batsmen can move ~5cm between frames. That critical moment of when the bat enters the crease and the bail leaving the spigot can still be guesswork due to blurred motion or the critical moment happening between a frame. It can be improved remarkably but the use of technology for run-outs and stumpings is a good application. Quote:
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http://www.thaindian.com/newsportal/...100134680.html Or concerns in slowing the game down...? http://www.thaindian.com/newsportal/...100131513.html Or... oops? http://content-usa.cricinfo.com/ci/c...ry/389874.html Quote:
Last edited by Rodp; 10-02-2009 at 10:42 AM. |
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#177 | |||||||
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#178 | ||||||
Regular Schmuck
Join Date: Dec 2004
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Of course it's improving but nowhere near the standard that it has to be in order to sacrifice the time and its traditions to move to it IMO. Quote:
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http://www.foxsports.com.au/story/0,...-23212,00.html So if the over rate target isn't reached because a dozen additional decisions were referred to the third umpire, who gets fined their match fee, the umpires? How about in cases of referrals where light is failing on the final overs of a test with a couple of wickets to get. Great stalling tactic, would work marvels in Pakistan. Quote:
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#179 | ||
Guest
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: Auckland, NZ
Posts: 2,886
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Lets keep it civil kiddies
![]() A batsman knows if he's nicked it, so if he is given LBW - he can appeal and hotspot clears it up in no time. Not out. Keep in mind a bowling team only gets 3 appeals per innings, so they must, and do, ration it - they don't just appeal everything. Ditto with a batting side. From the few games I saw with this system, teams only appealed a decision when they thought it was out. It's not a case of lets appeal for the sake of it. Back on topic, NZ have won the toss and will finally set a total for Aussie to chase. I hope that McCullum fires like the Kiwis know he can. Good to see there is a sombre mood out there inlight of whats happend over there. Here's hopeing a massive ammount of money is raised for the victims. |
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#180 | |||||||
FF.Com.Au Hardcore
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I remember when hawkeye was introduced into tennis. Sometimes it would 'beep' when the players hadn't even served. Critics like you said it was no good and would never take the place of human linesman. Times change, Rod, and now tennis has a referral system in place, accepted by all. Quote:
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Not a dozen, Rod, 6. 3 from each side per innings. I thought you said you watched these games ![]() ![]() Quote:
They all agreed that something had to be done by Ponting to 'up' his teams over rates. From the games I watched that had the appeals system in use, there was barely anymore of a hold up than usual. If a small amount of time is all thats sacrificed to get the correct decision, surely you can see the value in that. Quote:
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