New Nsw Car Hoon Laws . Grandma Policing .

[flappist]

Originally Posted by Djrystofer

If you get caught doing 155kph, you're an idiot.
If you get caught TWICE doing 155kph, within 5 months, you're an idiot.

Not saying they have the right to 'confiscate' your car, but you should've known when you got caught the first time not to do it again

So which is the idiotic bit?

Doing 155?
Doing 45 above a number on a sign?
Voting for those who limit a 155 capable road to 110?
Believing that travelling above 110 is too dangerous for Australian drivers?

[NC1183]

Originally Posted by Jim Goose

I answered this sort of question/ comment previously in this thread regarding roadworks and speed restrictions.

They cant put up say a 40kmh speed restriction suddenly if the speed limit is 80kmh for example.... it must go 80.... 60...... 40.
Again if you get pinged, dont pay the fine and go to the magistrates stating the signage was NOT set out according to the MUTC rules.

The problem is people dont know the rules and simply pay the fine.

Actually they don't have to drop the speed, "100km/h" to "80km/h" to "60km/h" to "40km/h" just to get to that 40km/h, they only have to have "60km/h Ahead" sign then the "60km/h" sign, and then the "40km/h" at there required distances of 2Dm of the work area. I have just finished doing the poxy RTA course again for the third time.

[xisled]

Originally Posted by blk6t

This is WRONG, you shouldn't lose your car if your doing 45+ over the limit. Your car should be confiscated if you are charged with Dangerous driving twice, or Drink driving twice NOT 45+ over!

As that picture shows if the limit there is 80km/h and you do 130kn/h very easily how is that dangerous, yes cop the fine for speeding etc.

The police need to determine if your driving manner is dangerous to the public then charge you accordingly, in the suburbs 30+km/h is dangerous to the public and done twice you should lose your car under the charge ONLY.

But the other factor is confiscating cars, that is private property and this law gives the government the right to take private property, whats next your house?

And if they crush your car what a waste of resources and money!

Any way we can argue all day but we have no impact on this so everyone check your speed!

I was caught up with one of the big bust for hoons in Melbourne a couple of years ago. One of the solicitors tried to argue that what his client was doing was not dangerous and the police had to prove what he was doing was dangerous. My solicitor turned to me and said, his statement even the prosecution would be proud of it. Basically, the argument was looked upon by the magistrate very badly and the guy got hit hard with a suspension.

[Auslandau]

On East link it is nearly a daily occurrence now ...... 100'ks with a 60 K ahead sign, hit 60 then straight into a 40 ..... past the few witches caps on the road for reasons unknown and then straight back into 100. Yep ..... people who drive it everyday are really slowing down now! Bit of cry wolf way too often. Great on 3 lanes of freeway with everyone doing anything from 35k's to 100. Its interesting to say the least. Few 100 cars per day would be towed away .....

[Jim Goose]

Originally Posted by NC1183

Actually they don't have to drop the speed, "100km/h" to "80km/h" to "60km/h" to "40km/h" just to get to that 40km/h, they only have to have "60km/h Ahead" sign then the "60km/h" sign, and then the "40km/h" at there required distances of 2Dm of the work area. I have just finished doing the poxy RTA course again for the third time.

I am referring to QLD.... and to road works areas where speed limits are temporary.... not referring to perminant speed signs. Which is what the comments were about...

[Djrystofer]

Originally Posted by flappist

So which is the idiotic bit?

Doing 155?
Doing 45 above a number on a sign?
Voting for those who limit a 155 capable road to 110?
Believing that travelling above 110 is too dangerous for Australian drivers?

I'm not saying it's not safe. I'm saying it's limited to 110. The limit isn't 'whatever speed you feel safe at'.

However stupid the rule may be, it's a rule. Like it or not, you're made to follow them.

[The G6ET Spot]

Originally Posted by gtfpv

in the papers and news today the state govt is introducing new speeding laws , where if you are caught pseeding at 45 kms over the limit , it will be an automatic , number plate taken from that car for 3 months !!!! and if caught agin within 5 months the car will be permanently confiscated by govt . what have we become ?
i thought losing your liscence was enough. now they can take your car off you , ( shouldnt they have to pay you for it ? it isnt thier property . WTF is going on here .
its possible in an fpv to overtake a car and increase your speed by 40km/hr in 2.5 seconds . to me i think they are going too hard on this , and perhaps if thats their NANNA plan . they better speed limit all cars to 110kms hour . ( whats the difference )
govts just seem to be able to do whatever someone person in power says , these days . ( NOT HAPPY JAN )

It is within 5 years not 5 months between offences.

HOONS caught drag racing, fleeing police or speeding at more than 45km/h over the limit will have their number plates immediately seized for three months under new laws to be introduced in NSW.

Cars would be permanently confiscated after a second offence if it occurs within five years or if the offender continued to drive after their number plates were confiscated.

But in saying that IMO if someone gets caught doing in excess of 45k's over the limit twice then they deserve to lose their car.

[flappist]

Originally Posted by Djrystofer

I'm not saying it's not safe. I'm saying it's limited to 110. The limit isn't 'whatever speed you feel safe at'.

However stupid the rule may be, it's a rule. Like it or not, you're made to follow them.

So what you are saying is if a rule is stupid you cannot force it to be changed you just have to follow it?

The limit has been "what you feel safe at" for much much longer than the paranoid "110 is too fast" and hopefully will be again soon at least in NT.

If something is wrong the constant media assault telling us it it is right does not actually make it right.....

[Kynan]

Australia needs an autobahn...

[TheInterceptor]

Heres a 2 minute unedited clip of what roads us Australians have out there. Limited to 110.
Also, as soon as we entered the Northern Territory (not in this clip), the limits increased to 130km/h but the road type and surface DID NOT CHANGE. Make sense? No, no sir.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7u-6-...ature=youtu.be

Looks pretty darn safe to me.

[BAFrod]

Originally Posted by charles_wif_xf

Without going into too much detail (and making a mockery of the site T&C's), the High Court judges are appointed by Govco. Make of that what you will.

I'm aware - but they're not beholden to government policy/political opinion... And have rendered many sitting governments' policies invalid. I'm suggesting the same could (and should) happen here.

[BHDOGS]

Originally Posted by The G6ET Spot

It is within 5 years not 5 months between offences.



But in saying that IMO if someone gets caught doing in excess of 45k's over the limit twice then they deserve to lose their car.

Thank u for bringing some common sense into this debate I think this clears up this whole argument both ways

[z80]

Originally Posted by TheInterceptor

Hi, do beleive this is the Barrier hwy between Broken Hill NSW and Peterborough SA. This isnt long compared to what is between Coober Pedy and Alice springs though.

was thinking exactly the same, it could even be east of Broken hill or south towards Mildura..

The danger with it is that there are stray wild 800kg cattle that stray onto that pristine open road...

Black angus are invisible at night.

[z80]

Originally Posted by TheInterceptor

Heres a 2 minute unedited clip of what roads us Australians have out there. Limited to 110.
Also, as soon as we entered the Northern Territory (not in this clip), the limits increased to 130km/h but the road type and surface DID NOT CHANGE. Make sense? No, no sir.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7u-6-...ature=youtu.be

Looks pretty darn safe to me.

In your video did you notice the cattle grid?

Probably why you have a speed limit there is the only reason i could think of.

[Fiesta_Man69]

Originally Posted by Jim Goose

I am referring to QLD.... and to road works areas where speed limits are temporary.... not referring to perminant speed signs. Which is what the comments were about...

On the Northern Rd, Cranebrook, NSW there are roadworks due to a new housing estate. The temporary roadwork signs are covered in green cloth when not in use. However, I am aware of more than two occasions where police have enforced the roadworks speed limit despite two of the 3 speed signs being "accidentally" covered. It is then up to motorists to take the matter to court.

The point being there is no check on these deliberate rorts: you are guilty until proven innocent: and now you can easily lose your car. Particularly if you are in a foreign area: not all school zones are lit, and roadworks at night/in the wet.

[gtfpv]

my mate just challanged a speeding ticket in court . on the basis that his car( a 12 year old 2 litre deisel 4 wheel drive of some sort) is not capable of doing 130km an hour up a hill towing a trailer with 2 motorbikes in it . it was all videoed , and the police car chasing him , ( doing a u turn and catching up to him at 150km/hr which almost caused to accidents with the police car ) any how my mate argued the case in court , the judge laughed at him basically , and suggested its right to go with the police over a civilian when in doubt , then made a suggestion that that spot is a good revenue raiser for the state , then ordered him to pay the fine and the court costs , and next time dont bother wasting court time on such a matter .

[pottery beige]

Originally Posted by gtfpv

my mate just challanged a speeding ticket in court . on the basis that his car( a 12 year old 2 litre deisel 4 wheel drive of some sort) is not capable of doing 130km an hour up a hill towing a trailer with 2 motorbikes in it . it was all videoed , and the police car chasing him , ( doing a u turn and catching up to him at 150km/hr which almost caused to accidents with the police car ) any how my mate argued the case in court , the judge laughed at him basically , and suggested its right to go with the police over a civilian when in doubt , then made a suggestion that that spot is a good revenue raiser for the state , then ordered him to pay the fine and the court costs , and next time dont bother wasting court time on such a matter .

how dare you question govcos revenue stream.....

[SB076]

Originally Posted by madwag

i gotta agree with some hoon laws.
45km over the limit twice in 5 months. And thats only if you get caught!

what reason could there be for going a potential 155kph?

No reason but different scenario you are driving down the monash at 2am, you go through what was a construction zone during the day (no one is there) But the signs are left up and you get pinged for doing 90k's in a 40 zone (even though its normally 100)

I am against speeding in residental areas, but on the open road, or with the above scenario there should be some other factors taken into an account.

The government only seems to have one focus on road safety and thats speed. Yet everyday I see someone do a U turn on a free way and occasionally I see someone turn right from the left lane etc, last night saw and old clapped out van merge on the freeway and pull straight into the right hand lane - doing all of 60 k's an hour and forcing traffic moving at 100k's to hit the brakes - But thats ok he wasnt speeding

[Jim Goose]

Originally Posted by SB076

No reason but different scenario you are driving down the monash at 2am, you go through what was a construction zone during the day (no one is there) But the signs are left up and you get pinged for doing 90k's in a 40 zone (even though its normally 100)

I think this road works thing has been done to death now...

There are warning signs put up to warn you that there are reduced speeds (irrespective if they are working or not). You cant have a 40kmh sign in a 100 zone with no other signs warning you of speed reductions.

Again... in QLD... if the signage IS NOT SET OUT AS PER THE MUTC then you can go to magistrates and get it overturned.

[charles_wif_xf]

Originally Posted by gtfpv

my mate just challanged a speeding ticket in court . on the basis that his car( a 12 year old 2 litre deisel 4 wheel drive of some sort) is not capable of doing 130km an hour up a hill towing a trailer with 2 motorbikes in it . it was all videoed , and the police car chasing him , ( doing a u turn and catching up to him at 150km/hr which almost caused to accidents with the police car ) any how my mate argued the case in court , the judge laughed at him basically , and suggested its right to go with the police over a civilian when in doubt , then made a suggestion that that spot is a good revenue raiser for the state , then ordered him to pay the fine and the court costs , and next time dont bother wasting court time on such a matter .

Please tell me transcripts are available somewhere of your friends case...

[ute83]

Originally Posted by Djrystofer

I'm not saying it's not safe. I'm saying it's limited to 110. The limit isn't 'whatever speed you feel safe at'.

However stupid the rule may be, it's a rule. Like it or not, you're made to follow them.

Because we are SHEEP..........................

[RedHotGT]

Wow - this thread really is turning out ridiculous isn't it??

Let me get this straight....

We're all still discussing how the speed limit of 130km/h / 110km/h on the Stuart Hwy is not fair - despite the fact that MOST of us will never actually drive it anyway?

We're still discussing how road-works safety signs should only be there when workers are working - despite the fact that we may not know or understand the scope of works that have already been completed / or uncompleted in that area...

And - we're still trying to justify why it's okay to speed?? And still trying to play the 'government conspiracy' to fine drivers and impound hoon cars...

Wow - I thought we'd grown up and gotten way passed this... Clearly I was wrong...

[XR6TCraig]

Originally Posted by 2011G6E

If you are blessed to live in the south east corner of Queensland for example, you could be forgiven for wondering what us country hicks are whinging about with our roads...aren't all highways a minimum of divided carriageway four lane highways on which 110 feels slow?

This is the reason that these threads last so long.
On one hand you have people living in the large capitals, who never leave them. They think of someone doing 45KPH over in a 50 zone past schools and think its unimaginably outrageous and it is. Same goes for freeways. There is no need to do 45KPH over the limit to get around a line of slower moving traffic. Just set the cruise control for 4KPH faster than those you wish to pass and you will get past eventually and be on your merry way.

Then on the other hand you have people living in large, vast sparsely populated areas, driving on roads like the one pictured in post #43 of this thread by The Interceptor, and then with a youtube clip in post #100. Just another typical, boring little bit of country road, 100klm from anywhere, and probably at least 600klm from the middle of Brisbane/Sydney/Melbourne Adelaide/Perth. This is a fairly typical country road where I live except for the amount of traffic. Someone here thought it was heaven. Truth is its hell, becasue doing 100KPH on a road like this makes you very fatigued and the same rules for speeding apply as they do on a major freeway 5klm from your capital city.

Now add to this road lots of traffic, a government who doesn't want to spend any money on said road, no overtaking lanes and people with many different levels of experience, age, vehicle types. You now have a congested piece road that no one can escape for many hours without overtaking. No use wating for an overtaking lane either, as there won't be any for 50klms and when you get to it eventually, all of those slower moving vehicles in front of you seem to find another cog and speed up for them anyway, only to slow down once the passing lane ends.

Trouble is there is so much oncoming traffic that passing opportunites outside of obligatory passing lane dotted every 50klm or so are few and far between. But there is a solution! Buy a reasonably powered car and pass quickly and safely in areas other than the [passing lanes. On a road like this that means FOOT DOWN AND GET BACK ONTO YOUR SIDE OF THE ROAD ASAP before a road train wears you and your family as a bonnet emblem.

The problem with this is that the government in their wisdom manage speed on a road like this as they would a 50KPH area in suburbia, yet the conditions and circumstances are vastly different.

If the government want to crush a persons car for repeatedly doing 45KPH past a school in suburbia while the lollypop ladies and 6YO school kids are just metres away, then that is fine. But don't treat a man trying to get past a couple of road trains or a long line of slower moving traffic in the middle of nowhere the same way.
Isn't this common sense?

Speed in country regions and outback areas away from suburbia is a victimless crime. There is no need to police it otherwise.

[2011G6E]

The end of the argument should be this:

You might trust in your god-like skills at 130 to 150 or more on the highways here as they are in the condition they are today. Fine.

However, look around you at the average standard of the average driver on the road with you...and I'll ask the question: Now do you still feel so confidant to bollock along at whatever speed you think you should be allowed to do, while these people are coming the other way (or you fly up behind them to overtake at a huge closing speed)...?

"Easy", you will counter..."I'll use my common sense to know the time and place I do the high speeds".

To which I retort: "Once again, look around at the dodgy overtaking and lane changing manoeuvres that the average Joe performs, even in the heaviest of traffic or on wide open highways where there aren't many other vehicles about...do you trust that all of them have such similar Formula-One-standard levels of reactions and judgement to what you are claiming to always use when you plan to be doing 150-plus?

Trusting souls, aren't you...

[gtfpv]

Originally Posted by charles_wif_xf

Please tell me transcripts are available somewhere of your friends case...

the only info i have is from his own mouth unfortunately , his friends , including me , all thought he wouldnt stand a chance getting off .
the main reason . >>> he represented himself .. no lawyer .
aside from that i have no transcript info nor knowledge of the laws regarding his case . sorry .

[NC1183]

Originally Posted by Jim Goose

I am referring to QLD.... and to road works areas where speed limits are temporary.... not referring to perminant speed signs. Which is what the comments were about...

Yep and i have done the QLD course and was told the same thing in that. And yes i am talking about temporary speed zones at road works.

[lamborghinifan]

Originally Posted by Craiginmackay

This is the reason that these threads last so long.
On one hand you have people living in the large capitals, who never leave them. They think of someone doing 45KPH over in a 50 zone past schools and think its unimaginably outrageous and it is. Same goes for freeways. There is no need to do 45KPH over the limit to get around a line of slower moving traffic. Just set the cruise control for 4KPH faster than those you wish to pass and you will get past eventually and be on your merry way.

Then on the other hand you have people living in large, vast sparsely populated areas, driving on roads like the one pictured in post #43 of this thread by The Interceptor, and then with a youtube clip in post #100. Just another typical, boring little bit of country road, 100klm from anywhere, and probably at least 600klm from the middle of Brisbane/Sydney/Melbourne Adelaide/Perth. This is a fairly typical country road where I live except for the amount of traffic. Someone here thought it was heaven. Truth is its hell, becasue doing 100KPH on a road like this makes you very fatigued and the same rules for speeding apply as they do on a major freeway 5klm from your capital city.

Now add to this road lots of traffic, a government who doesn't want to spend any money on said road, no overtaking lanes and people with many different levels of experience, age, vehicle types. You now have a congested piece road that no one can escape for many hours without overtaking. No use wating for an overtaking lane either, as there won't be any for 50klms and when you get to it eventually, all of those slower moving vehicles in front of you seem to find another cog and speed up for them anyway, only to slow down once the passing lane ends.

Trouble is there is so much oncoming traffic that passing opportunites outside of obligatory passing lane dotted every 50klm or so are few and far between. But there is a solution! Buy a reasonably powered car and pass quickly and safely in areas other than the [passing lanes. On a road like this that means FOOT DOWN AND GET BACK ONTO YOUR SIDE OF THE ROAD ASAP before a road train wears you and your family as a bonnet emblem.

The problem with this is that the government in their wisdom manage speed on a road like this as they would a 50KPH area in suburbia, yet the conditions and circumstances are vastly different.

If the government want to crush a persons car for repeatedly doing 45KPH past a school in suburbia while the lollypop ladies and 6YO school kids are just metres away, then that is fine. But don't treat a man trying to get past a couple of road trains or a long line of slower moving traffic in the middle of nowhere the same way.
Isn't this common sense?

Speed in country regions and outback areas away from suburbia is a victimless crime. There is no need to police it otherwise.

Absolutely True this post. There are at least two different types of "australians" when it comes to driving this vast country. I'd LOVE to put any of the top couple of politicians in the passenger seat and take them for a couple of thousand km trip through country vic/nsw/qld. I'm sure it would be a life changing experience for them!

[2011G6E]

Originally Posted by lamborghinifan

I'd LOVE to put any of the top couple of politicians in the passenger seat and take them for a couple of thousand km trip through country vic/nsw/qld. I'm sure it would be a life changing experience for them!

I'm sure it would...the kangaroos and other wildlife that seemingly appear out of nowhere despite your best efforts at being alert for them would give them the heebie jeebies and make them want to lower the limit out here even more...

I think the only reason they can get away with 130kph in the NT is that the whole Territory has less people living in it than a reasonable sized city down south. Out there it can be a real thrill to actually see another car coming towards you.

[charles_wif_xf]

Originally Posted by Craiginmackay

This is the reason that these threads last so long.
On one hand you have people living in the large capitals, who never leave them. They think of someone doing 45KPH over in a 50 zone past schools and think its unimaginably outrageous and it is. Same goes for freeways. There is no need to do 45KPH over the limit to get around a line of slower moving traffic. Just set the cruise control for 4KPH faster than those you wish to pass and you will get past eventually and be on your merry way.

Then on the other hand you have people living in large, vast sparsely populated areas, driving on roads like the one pictured in post #43 of this thread by The Interceptor, and then with a youtube clip in post #100. Just another typical, boring little bit of country road, 100klm from anywhere, and probably at least 600klm from the middle of Brisbane/Sydney/Melbourne Adelaide/Perth. This is a fairly typical country road where I live except for the amount of traffic. Someone here thought it was heaven. Truth is its hell, becasue doing 100KPH on a road like this makes you very fatigued and the same rules for speeding apply as they do on a major freeway 5klm from your capital city.

Now add to this road lots of traffic, a government who doesn't want to spend any money on said road, no overtaking lanes and people with many different levels of experience, age, vehicle types. You now have a congested piece road that no one can escape for many hours without overtaking. No use wating for an overtaking lane either, as there won't be any for 50klms and when you get to it eventually, all of those slower moving vehicles in front of you seem to find another cog and speed up for them anyway, only to slow down once the passing lane ends.

Trouble is there is so much oncoming traffic that passing opportunites outside of obligatory passing lane dotted every 50klm or so are few and far between. But there is a solution! Buy a reasonably powered car and pass quickly and safely in areas other than the [passing lanes. On a road like this that means FOOT DOWN AND GET BACK ONTO YOUR SIDE OF THE ROAD ASAP before a road train wears you and your family as a bonnet emblem.

The problem with this is that the government in their wisdom manage speed on a road like this as they would a 50KPH area in suburbia, yet the conditions and circumstances are vastly different.

If the government want to crush a persons car for repeatedly doing 45KPH past a school in suburbia while the lollypop ladies and 6YO school kids are just metres away, then that is fine. But don't treat a man trying to get past a couple of road trains or a long line of slower moving traffic in the middle of nowhere the same way.
Isn't this common sense?

Speed in country regions and outback areas away from suburbia is a victimless crime. There is no need to police it otherwise.

You raise some valid points Craig.

I for one am not going to get into the what speed is a safe speed. My bone of contention always was the lawfulness of Govco's actions, ie car impoundment and crushing, and speeding fines in general. Their actions raise questions regarding the legitimacy of their existence as a whole.

[Torment47]

Wow! am i screwed?? admitting to being a hoon.... i don't think i'd ever go 45km over the limit...... only got an AU but usually only go 5-10 over the limit in sydney, i admit i speed... doesn't matter if it's 1km or 45km over the limit Speeding is Speeding. i'm not happy with the "new rulling" get caught and have license plates taken away etc etc but i guess as some of you may be thinking, it's your own fault??
I've gone past a few radar guns and was about 3-5km over the limit on a few occasions, i guess there targeting people who are being "Dangerous"

C'mon fellow ford lovers, next time your on the road and wan't to give it to your ride, look out for coppa's, pulled over ve commadore's or fg falcons....
(or just drive the limit?)