Whats stopping people from buying the Falcon? - Page 27

Smoke Pursuit · 10-02-2012, 03:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gobes32

I haven't bought a new Falcon because I can't afford it, simple as that. In fact, I can't afford any new car. That is why I drive an EL and my wife has an AU2 wagon (which is a brilliant car fwiw). Until my mortgage comes down to a more sane level, I, like many of our friends, am going to hold onto our older cars and put every spare cent we have into our homes. I wonder how many other people are doing the same.

The thing is however people are still buying cars... They are just buying different ones.

Perhaps Ford Australia should put more effort into the Territory and have it as its main breadwinner... SUV's are growing more popular by the day.

Brazen · 10-02-2012, 03:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DASH GT

Perhaps Ford Australia should put more effort into the Territory and have it as its main breadwinner... SUV's are growing more popular by the day.

A sports version like SR or XR could be good as well as a mild-offroad version.

Cheap, easy and could add a couple of hundred sales a month.

MercuryT · 10-02-2012, 03:52 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gobes32

I haven't bought a new Falcon because I can't afford it, simple as that. In fact, I can't afford any new car. That is why I drive an EL and my wife has an AU2 wagon (which is a brilliant car fwiw). Until my mortgage comes down to a more sane level, I, like many of our friends, am going to hold onto our older cars and put every spare cent we have into our homes. I wonder how many other people are doing the same.

That is exactly right.

But even people who can afford a new car, with the dreadul resale they have (especially Falcons) it really is the prudent purchaser that waits a year or two and picks up a bargain (and puts the huge difference into other things).....its no wonder Ford are finding it so difficult.

prydey · 10-02-2012, 04:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MercuryT

yet they have managed to stuff nearly everything up for the last 10 years?

oh, ok then.

if more people bought lwb, they would still be available, if more people bought new xr8's, they would still be available. if more people bought wagons, they would still be available. euro 4 also threw a bit of a spanner in the works.

but lets just blame ford for everything.

oh thats right it was fords fault. lwb wasn't 'different' enough, the xr8 had a dud engine and wagon was agricultural and ugly. sorry, my bad. all fords fault.

**Polyal** · 10-02-2012, 05:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by prydey

oh, ok then.

if more people bought lwb, they would still be available, if more people bought new xr8's, they would still be available. if more people bought wagons, they would still be available. euro 4 also threw a bit of a spanner in the works.

but lets just blame ford for everything.

oh thats right it was fords fault. lwb wasn't 'different' enough, the xr8 had a dud engine and wagon was agricultural and ugly. sorry, my bad. all fords fault.

While I do agree a little bit with that theory....(lets face it makets/tastes change) Im also a firm believer that you have to spend money t make money (Miami is an example of this). Cut cut cut cut and you wont have anything left in your range or cars.

I dont think the LWB and certainly the XR8 died because that market had suddenly vanished...Ford simply didint invest in the tech people wanted or failed to keep up to par with the competition.

Only a crazy blue eyed supporter would buy the old Fairlane over a Statesman/Caprice. Driving dynamics mean little in that category, its about looks, tech, and standing out.

Point is that you cant blame the market for not buying something they either dont want or doesnt meet their criteria no matter how well its engineered.

In some circles its stated that Ford over engineer their cars, Holden simply add gizmo's etc that sell cars and get people in the door in the first place.

Franco Cozzo · 10-02-2012, 06:17 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by prydey

i've never understood what people mean when they make this comment! enlighten me. and whats your fetish with headlights? when it comes to light, the new projectors are rubbish compared to what they replaced.

so to make the falcon a car that people want, do they need to cut it in half? make it the size of a small car? do they need to jack it up and make it a suv/4wd?

the falcon is arguably the best in its class. not sure what else you want from it.

i think people are upset that their life circumstances, whether financial or otherwise, stop them from buying the falcon, so they have to try to justify their position by rubbishing falcon. they try to blame ford and falcon as to why there isn't one in their driveway. many people still want falcon to be the 'one size fits all' car. well it isn't and won't be again. thems the facts. want a ford wagon, buy mondeo or territory. want a ford ute. buy a ranger.

First off, its a large car, a segment which has been on the decline for a long time now, last month it only sold 950 cars, why "invest" money in something barely anyone buys, and no I don't believe its a lack of advertising because the name has been around since 1960, everyone knows what the Falcon is and that it still exists.

My fetish with headlights is we do a lot of night country driving, I'd rather have better headlights than go through with the hassle of insurance claims when I hit a roo because having crappy headlights means I didn't see it. Not everyone lives inside the embrace of street lights and inner suburbia. I guess thats why I have a pair of spotlights on my Focus and a full set of +100 phillips halogen globes.

If you think projectors are "rubbish" compared to reflectors, you need your eyes checked or need to drive a car which actually has a factory set of HIDs, the difference on my old mans car is like night and day and they're just HID reflectors, the luminosity of HIDs is nearly twice that of a halogen globe, projectors have a very sharp cut-off as well, which looks a hell of a lot nicer:

http://gallery.me.com/soulsea/100119...13236323440001

Look how evenly lit that is, how is that not better than halogen reflectors?

It needs more tech if it wants to appeal to a younger generation, for example, why doesn't it up auto up down on all windows? Thats pretty damn basic, my LV Focus has that and it costs about $10K less than the Falcon, why is it only now we have an 8" colour screen? Why not the whole MyFord system which is coming to the Focus mid this year?

Yes its the best in its class, I agree, but being the best in the class doesn't matter when people are buying small, mid-sized cars and SUVs, does it? Maybe they ditch the Falcon and do the next iteration of the Mondeo here?

I actually can afford a new MKII Falcon, thats no issue, thats the benefit of working two jobs, but I'd like a car I'd actually be able to drive comfortably, my issues are:

- Seat doesn't go low enough and the steering column high enough, it makes it awkward to get in and out of.

- I went to pop the bonnet and the latch fell off in my hand in one of the original FG Falcons I first sat in.

- There isn't enough tech, the "premium" stereo sucks compared to my WS Fiesta's base stereo, the car cost half as much, it doesn't even have the most basic auto up/down on all windows, no heated mirrors.

- No HID headlights in a $36K+ car

- No diesel option, I'm a P plater I can't drive Ecoboost.

- Low quality interior, hard plastics, this is also an issue in the Commodore.

Ford bet on LPG when diesel seems to be the new fetish, particularily in SUVs (why did they wait so long on the Territory?) and small cars there is a bit of a takeup there.

Which brings me to my next point, why did they bother with the new Ranger when they have F150? The ranger is like 90% of the length of the F150 anyways.

brett7777 · 10-02-2012, 06:37 PM

I remember a song on a childrens program that went 'this is the song that never ends'.
This is the thread that never ends :-)
And are we any the wiser?
Everyone sure expressed an opinion anyway

**Polyal** · 10-02-2012, 06:43 PM

I think this thread is just a reflection of how the Ford faithful are feeling, which is frustration. I tell you Ford NA would want to be coming up with a killer plan.

burnz · 10-02-2012, 06:44 PM

considering the commodore's had an option for projector since VY series, i agree damo..

MercuryT · 10-02-2012, 07:20 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by prydey

oh, ok then.

lets just blame ford for everything.

oh thats right it was fords fault. lwb wasn't 'different' enough, the xr8 had a dud engine and wagon was agricultural and ugly. sorry, my bad. all fords fault.

What are you on about?

So the XR8 having a "dud" (Ford) engine is not Fords fault? So not having a Sportswagon and only offering an "agricultural and ugly" (Ford) wagon is not Ford's fault?

Who's fault is it then for these Ford cars, im all ears!! Mine? The Prime Ministers? North Korea? Sorry, your post makes absolutely no sense....ha ha.

burnz · 10-02-2012, 07:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MercuryT

What are you on about? You defend Ford but then bag them out?

So the XR8 having a "dud" (Ford) engine is not Fords fault? So not having a Sportswagon and only offering an "agricultural and ugly" (Ford) wagon is not Ford's fault?

Who's fault is it then for these Ford cars, im all ears!! Mine? The Prime Ministers? North Korea? Sorry, your post makes absolutely no sense....ha ha.

sarcasm not a strong point ay?

fugitive.rmx · 10-02-2012, 07:54 PM

I own a Fairmont at the moment and I sometimes think what my next car will be...around the city a 4 cyl is looking more and more appealing but when I get out onto the open road I really do appreciate the comfort of the 'mont...I think a lot of people are drawn into the idea that the 4 cylinder will save them money but I've seen plenty of people who drive them hard and get no better (if not worse) economy than my 6...

prydey · 10-02-2012, 08:04 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MercuryT

What are you on about?

So the XR8 having a "dud" (Ford) engine is not Fords fault? So not having a Sportswagon and only offering an "agricultural and ugly" (Ford) wagon is not Ford's fault?

Who's fault is it then for these Ford cars, im all ears!! Mine? The Prime Ministers? North Korea? Sorry, your post makes absolutely no sense....ha ha.

the 5.4 boss was not a dud by any means. it was just as fast as the commodore and xr6t in standard form (give or take, depending on which publication you read) and was actually more economical than commodore's AFM tech. nearly every person who owns an xr8 is more than happy with it. i will never subscribe to the opinion that it was a dud engine.

the wagon was going to cost too much to upgrade and ford canned it hoping to boost the sales of 2 other wagons it already has in its stable. the mondeo and territory. they new they would lose a few hundred sales from telstra each month but no one else was really buying them and they probably figured they would gain them in the other 2 models, which they probably have.

rather than borrow, beg and steal and build a new wagon with someone else's money, they decided to end it, which camry and magna did years earlier. no one on here has access to the same data they had at the time so its a bit harsh to critisize them when viewing in hindsight. speaking of hindsight, there is a lot of it in this thread. everyone's an expert after the fact.

burnz · 10-02-2012, 08:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by prydey

everyone's an expert after the fact.

yes we are expert after the fact, sad that it's used so much..
gotta love hindsight..

bad moon rising · 10-02-2012, 10:13 PM

people just dont want it anymore,

just look at the facts, ford has what i would call the best 6cyl and v8s on the market, a great auto trans, great handling,decent on fuel for its size etc etc and people still arnt buying it, the commodores sales are double falcons, they should just kill it now instead of letting it die a slow painful death, just bring the fusion/taurus to aus and hope for the best.

i dont think there is anything ford can do to get the falcon to the top of the sales charts short on doing a buy 1 get 1 free deal.

Bossxr8 · 10-02-2012, 10:48 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by prydey

all those big ford screens and banners at every cricket ground this summer must have been a hallucination then.

And what are they promoting, New Ranger. Not a single one promoting an australian made Falcon or Territory.

Seems like Ford only want to promote imported cars now, forget the local stuff cause its too late to save it and not worth the effort.

Not promoting the New Falcon FG2 is staggering.

Ford have never, ever not promoted a new or upgraded Falcon. It seems like they just consider it a lost cause now and won't bother to promote it.

brett7777 · 10-02-2012, 10:52 PM

well, on the bright side, if they phase out the Falcon I guess all the existing Falcons will become collectable.
Especially when everyone has converted over to driving electric :-)

brett7777 · 11-02-2012, 12:34 PM

Hey about there being no FG XR8's...I just saw a pic of an FG XR8 on Isaac Performance Vehicles Website, in their dyno pics

Ramathorn · 11-02-2012, 12:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Polyal

I think this thread is just a reflection of how the Ford faithful are feeling, which is frustration. I tell you Ford NA would want to be coming up with a killer plan.

Ford NA do have a killer plan...unfortunately it is to kill off Ford AUS

MercuryT · 11-02-2012, 02:13 PM

[quote=prydey]the 5.4 boss was not a dud by any means. it was just as fast as the commodore and xr6t in standard form (give or take, depending on which publication you read) and was actually more economical than commodore's AFM tech. nearly every person who owns an xr8 is more than happy with it. i will never subscribe to the opinion that it was a dud engine.

quote]

The 5.4 was an OK engine mate for sure (sounded brilliant).

But not sure what publications you are reading, but none suggested it was a fast as the Turbo and it was also behing the Chev Gen 3/4.

People are happy with it because they are V8 fans (as am I!), but I (and many others) were really disappointed with the Boss and chose the turbo for that exact reason - I didnt like buying the slowest/thirstiest/heaviest engine of the three for 50K. I mustnt be alone the XR8 was canned for very poor sales remember.

prydey · 11-02-2012, 05:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bossxr8

And what are they promoting, New Ranger. Not a single one promoting an australian made Falcon or Territory.

some banners said 'ranger', others just had the ford logo and slogan. they do have a website you know!!

when people buy things (tv's, whitegoods, etc) they research on the net, but apparently when it comes to cars they rely on tv commercials

Brazen · 11-02-2012, 05:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by prydey

some banners said 'ranger', others just had the ford logo and slogan. they do have a website you know!!

when people buy things (tv's, whitegoods, etc) they research on the net, but apparently when it comes to cars they rely on tv commercials

A brand new car is often an emotional purchase, very much a "I gotta have one".

comagutsa · 11-02-2012, 05:21 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by brett7777

Hey about there being no FG XR8's...I just saw a pic of an FG XR8 on Isaac Performance Vehicles Website, in their dyno pics

haha i got one...

hey mercuryT if ford didnt have a xr6t then they would be still making the xr8 today... the 6t took so much of the xr8 sales coz people could have a car that was just as fast and used less on fuel and was cheaper and the biggest thing was the emission laws that killed the v8. its not because the v8s were crap

MercuryT · 11-02-2012, 05:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by comagutsa

haha i got one...

hey mercuryT if ford didnt have a xr6t then they would be still making the xr8 today... the 6t took so much of the xr8 sales coz people could have a car that was just as fast and used less on fuel and was cheaper and the biggest thing was the emission laws that killed the v8. its not because the v8s were crap

Wasn't that my exact point that I made? Good engine just not "as" good. I didnt say they were "crap"?!

ps: "Just as fast" - mate, the V8 doesnt hold a candle to the T. Hasnt done so since 02, but the Coyote Gt is another story......

onfire · 11-02-2012, 05:58 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by prydey

some banners said 'ranger', others just had the ford logo and slogan. they do have a website you know!!

when people buy things (tv's, whitegoods, etc) they research on the net, but apparently when it comes to cars they rely on tv commercials

As pointed out, and as you'll continually ignore it.

It's about keeping the brand, and the product in people's heads, just as much as it is about introducing or establishing a brand name.

It's the reason why you order a bourbon & coke, not a bourbon & cola. Because Coca Cola have down an incredible job at imprinting " Coke " in people's head due to a constant stream of advertising, cross-promotion, point of sale and product placement.

It's the reason why people will line up all week for an Iphone, instead of purchasing a far superior Android model. ;)

You could argue that the reason Commodore is outselling the Falcon 2:1, is because Holden have done an incredible job at establishing, maintaining and promoting it's product. They've told the public, the Commodore is Australia's favourite car, and continue to do it, confidently and consistently, to the point they've been able to sell a less quality car 2 fold over it's closest rival.

Attention spans are short, people need to be reminded.

martyk54 · 11-02-2012, 06:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by prydey

the 5.4 boss was not a dud by any means. it was just as fast as the commodore and xr6t in standard form (give or take, depending on which publication you read)

If you could present a link or location of just one of these reviews, which suggests so, I'd be interested to have a read. The FG XR6T destroys XR8. This is coming from someone who has owned both. I'm just talking in the figures either, a much nicer driving experience.

Quote:

Originally Posted by prydey

and was actually more economical than commodore's AFM tech. nearly every person who owns an xr8 is more than happy with it. i will never subscribe to the opinion that it was a dud engine.

Dud may be a harsh term... Still, if you'd drove the 3 (XR6T, XR8, SS) back to back, you'd be a fool to choose the XR8. It really had nothing going for it in that company, this was the issue.

gtxb67 · 11-02-2012, 11:03 PM

the advertising thing is interesting
when we went looking for a brand new suv, the advertising on tv had no influence on us at all
from memory the main suv ads are for the dualis and the outlander. we didn't look at either

we looked at the crv, the cx7 and the rav4 because of our preconceived ideas on what we wanted. my wife wanted a honda. i suggested the mazda (through moff) and toyota had a massive used car sale where we found the rav4 we were after

the territory was next on our list and then maybe some others but we didn't need to look so long. so basically nissan and mitsubishi spent all of that money on advertising and it made not one bit of difference to not buying their car. and the cars that are not advertised are the ones we were most likely to buy . . . go figure

Nic85 · 12-02-2012, 08:34 AM

Too bad you didn't look at the Outlander. It was one my partner and I compared to the Rav4, CX7 etc when buying our car. It has a much nicer interior than Rav4, smoother engine (the 3L V6), better AWD system and is a much nicer drive. Probably can't go too wrong with a Rav4 though.

gtxb67 · 12-02-2012, 10:05 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nic85

Too bad you didn't look at the Outlander. It was one my partner and I compared to the Rav4, CX7 etc when buying our car. It has a much nicer interior than Rav4, smoother engine (the 3L V6), better AWD system and is a much nicer drive. Probably can't go too wrong with a Rav4 though.

maybe, but we got the cruiser l with a manual. my wife did not want an auto, but with all of the luxury models, that was almost impossible. we got lucky and found one of the few luxury models with a manual, and was even lucky enough to get it in the seduce type colour - it had 11,000 on it, but it had everything we wanted

but it was down to perceptions when we bought - not advertising

jpd80 · 12-02-2012, 10:27 AM

Speaking of Landcruisers,
Workmate Wagon $61,990 drive away....
Workmate Ute $61,990 drive away....

And yet there is no place for F150 or F 250.....so sad.