Why is Ford really giving up on Falcon and Territory?

[Trump]

Originally Posted by ltd

Your avatar always creates a process for me.
I literally cannot ever see it and not laugh. Then I feel guilty for laughing and wonder about that poor woman's well-being; being exposed on the interwebs and all.
Then I have to remind myself of Trigglypuff so I can laugh again. WARNING: NSFW.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Y69tkCbeC5o

You're welcome

I do like the comedian's (seated on the far right) rant shortly afterwards.

Anyway back on topic

[Vesper Martini]

Originally Posted by XWGT

Actually the reason has nothing to do with Australia
Ford globally wanted to stream line its product lines. This allows for much more cost effective manufacturing and logistics, support and admin.
As the CEO said, Boeing dont make different 747s for different countries. Ford no longer makes local small market vehicles.
So they have created a line up of vehicles they think will appeal to 90% of their markets that they can manufacture cheaply and support locally.
Falcon could have doubled its sales and it still wouldnt have survived. Its a global decision not a local one.

This sums it up for me, if somehow they managed to double or triple the Sales it wouldn't matter the end was already decided. the Government's knew this so were correct to pull out funding for a lost cause.

Cars are produced on Platforms these days, shared across models and even different makes. Ford & Holden Australia bucked the Global trend.

Toyota I'm not sure about - it has to be just about cost for them.

[GT450]

Originally Posted by XWGT

Actually the reason has nothing to do with Australia
Ford globally wanted to stream line its product lines. This allows for much more cost effective manufacturing and logistics, support and admin.
As the CEO said, Boeing dont make different 747s for different countries. Ford no longer makes local small market vehicles.
So they have created a line up of vehicles they think will appeal to 90% of their markets that they can manufacture cheaply and support locally.
Falcon could have doubled its sales and it still wouldnt have survived. Its a global decision not a local one.

I couldn't have put it better myself XWGT ,we are part of the world we are not the world itself as some on here would believe. We are still going to be able to buy some great Fords so the sooner we stop asking why we cant have a Falcon and embrace the future the sooner we will stop getting these mind numbing questions. Ford in Australia has changed it has not died.
GT450

[sagewah]

So what are we going to have to buy once falcodores aren't available? All I want out of life is a nice, reasonable priced, I6 (although if I'm forced to a commonwhore I'll settle for the V), RWD rolling armchair, that's built to last, cheap and easy to work on and with enough poke that I can tow a trailer and still get past ********* on the highway. Nothing else fits the bill as far as I know :(

[XWGT]

Chrysler 300C
Or take your pick from 10,000 used Falcons under 3 years old?

[Vesper Martini]

I find on this forum a lot of people having a whinge about the loss of the Falcon, are not even in the new car market.. and have years of 2nd hand cars to choose from anyway.

[minheim]

Originally Posted by Charliewool

Greedy trade union movement was the root cause of the demise of our local auto industry.

The root cause is lack of economy of scale and our distance from markets; together with the fact that none of our manufactures were locally owned. Germany has higher wages than Australia and provides greater government assistance.

[jpd80]

Opportunity cost.
To invest n a next generation Falcon would cost close on $700 million
and if you co-deverloped territory at the same time perhaps $1 billion dollars.

Now, given the rather low sales rate of local Falcon and Territory, the very best
you could hope for is to pay back those up front product cycle costs.

When Ford chooses not to invest that billion in next gen product cycles,
it is freed up to be used localising other global products for sale here
but more importantly, not spending that amount in the first place
frees up that funding elsewhere in the company for a better return.

[Ben73]

Originally Posted by sagewah

So what are we going to have to buy once falcodores aren't available?:(

You will have to compromise like people do every day in life.

I want a mid to large dual cab ute with a turbo diesel V8 for a reasonable price. But that doesn't exist in Australia so I buy other things.

[fgpsi]

Originally Posted by galaxy xr8

Are you really the Hulk ???
3 Falcons and a Territory ?.

dont forget the C63 AMG

[Kieron]

New2Ford, XWGT have the correct answer. Back in the GFC, Ford had too many platforms, all of which required continuous development so straight away, Ford where always behind the 8 ball compared to Toyota, Nissan, Mazda etc

Mullaly introduced the "One Ford" concept and chose the best platform for the jobs required, that meant some models had to die. The US Focus went, replaced by the Euro Focus and a few years back, the US Fusion (on the CD3 Mazda platform) was dumped for the Euro Fusion (CD4 Ford platform) for example.

The Falcon/Territory are orphan platforms and in the dying large car category so One Ford killed them.

Most of the reasons mentioned by others in this thread are essentially reasons why vehicle MANUFACTURING has died in this country.

[Shonky.]

Originally Posted by ltd

Simple. Your average Australians purchasing habits are dictated to by their wallets. If you've ever bought anything from Bunnings, Coles, Woolies etc then you've contributed to the problem. Loose laws governing product origin allows for manufacturers to source their product in China, repackage it in Milperra and say "Made in Australia".
For example, go to your local coles or woolies and try and buy some fresh fish. Have a look at where it comes from. You'll soon see that the majority of these items are sourced from overseas (often waters where sewage flows) - even though we make the superior and cleaner product here. In fact, we have the best quality seafood in the world which sees it fetch a premium in Asia. So essentially, we buy the rubbish fish from Asia (that asians won't eat) cheap and they buy the high quality seafood from us at a premium.
What's this got to do with cars? Not much, but now you can say that you know what it has to do with the price of fish.

It's the same here with our auto industry. In Australia millions have bought Kia's, Hyundai's, Chery's - all manner of poxy-boxy Asian poo to save a buck. This action has seen less demand for Australian cars which additionally have a cultural cringe factor attached to them as "bogan cars".
For those who like to pose, they've spent more on cars like Audi, Mercedes, VW, BMW as Euro is obviously superior to anything we do here - even though all the lower end models are manufactured in Asia or other third world nations under license - but hey, idiots with more dollars than sense don't want to look like a bogan.

Then we have the idiotic governments that first abolished tariffs, and then set up free trade agreements with the competitive nations like China. Funny thing is, China and most other nations still have tariffs to protect their own industries, but retarded politicians accept their assurances that they don't. Furthermore, governments then fiddle with the anti dumping laws which allow products to be dumped into markets like Australia to sell for less than the cost of manufacture in order to kill the local competition. For this treachery the government of the day gives itself a pat on the back and a payrise.

Given the fact that the manufacturing industry is on its knees thanks to the buying public, the treasonous governments, the business destroying legislation, and the lack of support overall we then have the unions. In response to falling sales and increased costs, these geniuses decide to strike for more money for employees, even when the jobs of said employees are under threat. So costs of manufacturing go up, and the ability to compete against nations dumping their cheap crap here is decimated. The result? Company goes bust and thousands are without a job.

In summary, Australians have given up on Australia and couldn't care where their possessions come from, but will happily whinge when someone they know can't find a job.
It seems we as a nation are more interested in taking male and female signs off toilet doors for risk of offending someone, or creating safe spaces for those who take offense like that David Morrison she-thing who would like to see the word "guys" banned for being sexist.

awesome post

I spend my life blowing up at people's short sightedness

can't wait for this to come in

http://www.foodstandards.gov.au/cons...s/default.aspx

hoping it will help educate people and make them start to think about the consequences of their purchasing decisions

I always say to people, would you rather give $1 to a mate, or 90c to a stranger?

[Crazy Dazz]

The Falcon was and is a damn fine car.
Fact is that FA could still be selling more of them, but they have been in "closing down mode" for several years now.
Sure, its nolonger Australia's top selling car each month (But STILL Australia's "Top Selling Car" of all-time) but they still sell more than many other cars.

If the Falcon was selling allover the world, in proportionate numbers, it would make sense for Ford to keep making it somewhere. We'd either get them from a NA factory in Mexico, or from Thailand. But even at its most recent peak, Falcon production was nowhere near the global volume required to be viable in the modern market.

The question about a niche market has some merit. There are manufactures who target niche markets, and they do so profitably. But in any field, be it cars or white goods, that's NOT what the big players do. They basically fight for a slice of the largest markets.

In a way, we should be grateful that the Falcon lasted as long as it did, and in its traditional form. Ford could have started morphing the Falcon long ago, to the point where it was a medium-large FWD sedan with a big 4 or compact V6, and we would barely have noticed when they started being imported from Thailand or SA.

Part of the contributing problem, is that once Ford sold off Jag, AM, & Volvo, and moved all their big NA cars to FWD, they nolonger support a large RWD platform. To the extent that FA had to develop their own platform, the E8, for the FG. That was never going to be sustainable long-term. There was talk at one point of moving the Mustang to a common RWD platform, which would have kept development alive, or even simply building a 4 door saloon on the Mustang platform. But I can imagine the Mustang development division would be powerful and would have jealously guarded their crown jewels.

Ultimately, Ford have decided to retire the Falcon nameplate for socio-political reasons, and I applaud that. From FA's perspective, the current large RWD sedan will be replaced by the Mondeo/Fusion, a largish FWD sedan.
The Terry will be replaced by the Everest and possibly a RHD version of the Flex or Explorer. (Which may even carry the Territory name.)

[tranquilized]

Originally Posted by ltd

Simple. Your average Australians purchasing habits are dictated to by their wallets. If you've ever bought anything from Bunnings, Coles, Woolies etc then you've contributed to the problem. Loose laws governing product origin allows for manufacturers to source their product in China, repackage it in Milperra and say "Made in Australia".
For example, go to your local coles or woolies and try and buy some fresh fish. Have a look at where it comes from. You'll soon see that the majority of these items are sourced from overseas (often waters where sewage flows) - even though we make the superior and cleaner product here. In fact, we have the best quality seafood in the world which sees it fetch a premium in Asia. So essentially, we buy the rubbish fish from Asia (that asians won't eat) cheap and they buy the high quality seafood from us at a premium.
What's this got to do with cars? Not much, but now you can say that you know what it has to do with the price of fish.

It's the same here with our auto industry. In Australia millions have bought Kia's, Hyundai's, Chery's - all manner of poxy-boxy Asian poo to save a buck. This action has seen less demand for Australian cars which additionally have a cultural cringe factor attached to them as "bogan cars".
For those who like to pose, they've spent more on cars like Audi, Mercedes, VW, BMW as Euro is obviously superior to anything we do here - even though all the lower end models are manufactured in Asia or other third world nations under license - but hey, idiots with more dollars than sense don't want to look like a bogan.

Then we have the idiotic governments that first abolished tariffs, and then set up free trade agreements with the competitive nations like China. Funny thing is, China and most other nations still have tariffs to protect their own industries, but retarded politicians accept their assurances that they don't. Furthermore, governments then fiddle with the anti dumping laws which allow products to be dumped into markets like Australia to sell for less than the cost of manufacture in order to kill the local competition. For this treachery the government of the day gives itself a pat on the back and a payrise.

Given the fact that the manufacturing industry is on its knees thanks to the buying public, the treasonous governments, the business destroying legislation, and the lack of support overall we then have the unions. In response to falling sales and increased costs, these geniuses decide to strike for more money for employees, even when the jobs of said employees are under threat. So costs of manufacturing go up, and the ability to compete against nations dumping their cheap crap here is decimated. The result? Company goes bust and thousands are without a job.

In summary, Australians have given up on Australia and couldn't care where their possessions come from, but will happily whinge when someone they know can't find a job.
It seems we as a nation are more interested in taking male and female signs off toilet doors for risk of offending someone, or creating safe spaces for those who take offense like that David Morrison she-thing who would like to see the word "guys" banned for being sexist.

Simple?

SIMPLE?

Actually, in reality it's due to a huge number of complex and interwoven reasons, but according to you its simple? The length of your own post contradicts that straight off the bat.

There are elements of truth to everything you've said, hence the positive response to your post. But the reasons you've listed vary from minor to all but irrelevant when compared to the main reason we're losing our industry - and that is because we never had one! It was always owned by offshore interests with no interest in Australia or Australians. It was them who decided their bottom line would improve if they closed little ole aussie down (in large part due to government policies - like I said, interwoven... And you mentioned this also) so they steered our industry to its demise via decades of carefully planned product decisions which made blaming the closures on all kinds of reasons except the real ones the eventual outcome.

Simple hey.

[CyberWasp]

At least Ford hasn't given up on the Territory.
Instead of employing a whole factory of people to make and assemble them locally, they will employ a person or two to remove Edge badges and replace them with Territory ones as they arrive off the boat.

[Phildo]

Originally Posted by Bevsta007

I find on this forum a lot of people having a whinge about the loss of the Falcon, are not even in the new car market.. and have years of 2nd hand cars to choose from anyway.

That's me, but I like to know what's around now so that I know what I can look forward to buying in the future.

Right now I'm into FPV utes. Maybe in years time I'll get into WRXes or something thing, but if I want a late-ish model ute in 10 years time then I'm stuffed (ie something that's not 4WD style).

[Franco Cozzo]

Originally Posted by ltd

Simple. Your average Australians purchasing habits are dictated to by their wallets. If you've ever bought anything from Bunnings, Coles, Woolies etc then you've contributed to the problem. Loose laws governing product origin allows for manufacturers to source their product in China, repackage it in Milperra and say "Made in Australia".
For example, go to your local coles or woolies and try and buy some fresh fish. Have a look at where it comes from. You'll soon see that the majority of these items are sourced from overseas (often waters where sewage flows) - even though we make the superior and cleaner product here. In fact, we have the best quality seafood in the world which sees it fetch a premium in Asia. So essentially, we buy the rubbish fish from Asia (that asians won't eat) cheap and they buy the high quality seafood from us at a premium.
What's this got to do with cars? Not much, but now you can say that you know what it has to do with the price of fish.

It's the same here with our auto industry. In Australia millions have bought Kia's, Hyundai's, Chery's - all manner of poxy-boxy Asian poo to save a buck. This action has seen less demand for Australian cars which additionally have a cultural cringe factor attached to them as "bogan cars".
For those who like to pose, they've spent more on cars like Audi, Mercedes, VW, BMW as Euro is obviously superior to anything we do here - even though all the lower end models are manufactured in Asia or other third world nations under license - but hey, idiots with more dollars than sense don't want to look like a bogan.

Then we have the idiotic governments that first abolished tariffs, and then set up free trade agreements with the competitive nations like China. Funny thing is, China and most other nations still have tariffs to protect their own industries, but retarded politicians accept their assurances that they don't. Furthermore, governments then fiddle with the anti dumping laws which allow products to be dumped into markets like Australia to sell for less than the cost of manufacture in order to kill the local competition. For this treachery the government of the day gives itself a pat on the back and a payrise.

Given the fact that the manufacturing industry is on its knees thanks to the buying public, the treasonous governments, the business destroying legislation, and the lack of support overall we then have the unions. In response to falling sales and increased costs, these geniuses decide to strike for more money for employees, even when the jobs of said employees are under threat. So costs of manufacturing go up, and the ability to compete against nations dumping their cheap crap here is decimated. The result? Company goes bust and thousands are without a job.

In summary, Australians have given up on Australia and couldn't care where their possessions come from, but will happily whinge when someone they know can't find a job.
It seems we as a nation are more interested in taking male and female signs off toilet doors for risk of offending someone, or creating safe spaces for those who take offense like that David Morrison she-thing who would like to see the word "guys" banned for being sexist.

I'm a distributor for REDARC products, they're a South Australian company who designs and manufactures automotive related electronics right here in Australia:

https://www.redarc.com.au/

Also I'm a distributor for Century Batteries and stock wise I'm one of the top two businesses who carry biggest range of their products in Victoria:

http://www.cyb.com.au/home

They're locally designed and made products, but everyone starts squealing about price, yes REDARC products are more expensive than their competitors, but its good stuff and a lot of it is made locally.

Same thing with Century batteries, if its got a blue and yellow case, its made in Brisbane, and they've been making batteries since 1926.

But again price, people don't want to pay what it costs for locally manufactured products, they squeal ***** and cry about it because they can save $20 by buying some cheap BS from Thailand, its 'too expensive' to buy locally made products.

But they're the first to whinge and complain if their job gets outsourced.

Its always an up hill battle with these people I face daily.

One of my customers today told me the caravan manufacturer who made his caravan said to him he doesn't use REDARC products because they're too expensive, well mofo why should I buy a caravan you make when I can get some Chinese person to make it for 1/10th of the cost you can?

[Fordman1]

Originally Posted by CyberWasp

At least Ford hasn't given up on the Territory.
Instead of employing a whole factory of people to make and assemble them locally, they will employ a person or two to remove Edge badges and replace them with Territory ones as they arrive off the boat.

If that is true they'll be fitting Territory badges in the Canadian plant.

As if they'll be fitting badges here ...

[buggerlugs]

Funny how DRZ250 (Hulk) starts threads then disappears....

[Trump]

Originally Posted by Big Damo

I'm a distributor for REDARC products, they're a South Australian company who designs and manufactures automotive related electronics right here in Australia:

https://www.redarc.com.au/

Also I'm a distributor for Century Batteries and stock wise I'm one of the top two businesses who carry biggest range of their products in Victoria:

http://www.cyb.com.au/home

They're locally designed and made products, but everyone starts squealing about price, yes REDARC products are more expensive than their competitors, but its good stuff and a lot of it is made locally.

Same thing with Century batteries, if its got a blue and yellow case, its made in Brisbane, and they've been making batteries since 1926.

But again price, people don't want to pay what it costs for locally manufactured products, they squeal ***** and cry about it because they can save $20 by buying some cheap BS from Thailand, its 'too expensive' to buy locally made products.

But they're the first to whinge and complain if their job gets outsourced.

Its always an up hill battle with these people I face daily.

One of my customers today told me the caravan manufacturer who made his caravan said to him he doesn't use REDARC products because they're too expensive, well mofo why should I buy a caravan you make when I can get some Chinese person to make it for 1/10th of the cost you can?

Here here!!!

(insert table thumping here)

[Moby Vic]

Originally Posted by madmelon

Falcon and Fairlane could have easily replaced the pathetic Crown Victoria in US and Mid-East decades ago.

Hey now! I've been driving one for 15 years. It's a real workhorse, and its simplicity contributes to great reliability. Ford abandoned retail pretensions with it around 2000--it was a great fleet car.

But the rest of your post was spot on.

[Shonky.]

Originally Posted by tranquilized

Simple?

SIMPLE?

Actually, in reality it's due to a huge number of complex and interwoven reasons, but according to you its simple? The length of your own post contradicts that straight off the bat.

There are elements of truth to everything you've said, hence the positive response to your post. But the reasons you've listed vary from minor to all but irrelevant when compared to the main reason we're losing our industry - and that is because we never had one! It was always owned by offshore interests with no interest in Australia or Australians. It was them who decided their bottom line would improve if they closed little ole aussie down (in large part due to government policies - like I said, interwoven... And you mentioned this also) so they steered our industry to its demise via decades of carefully planned product decisions which made blaming the closures on all kinds of reasons except the real ones the eventual outcome.

Simple hey.

it is very, very simple, rest assured

simple concepts often require the most explanation, so your assessment of his post is very flawed

if everyone bought local when they could, then the rest would work itself out

governments would be forced to follow the publics preferences or risk being voted out

retailers and producers would be forced to use local stuff themselves because they'd know they wont sell as much if they don't

companies wouldn't move manufacturing offshore, as they know people would stop buying


your statements about foreign ownership are equally flawed

from an economic perspective foreign ownership of local manufacturing is a wonderful thing

the manufacturing process is where the wealth is created, not the delivery of profit to owners; whilst its nice if profit stays local it is nowhere near as important

this is because economic value, measured in GDP, is created by value added

the tiny amount of profit that flows offshore pales compared to the overall revenue that the industry creates, most of which stays in our economy as value added

all the intermediate and primary goods purchased, all the supporting industries kept in business, supply chains both up and downstream, all the people employed in the actual manufacture and support, onshore management structures, onshore admin, onshore hr

this is all good stuff for the economy

you are in fact actually part of the problem

you are creating disinformation, and making readers dumber, by try to distract from someone's well intentioned attempt to educate people to create better outcomes

you should try reading a book before you gob off about stuff you know nothing about

if you don't understand the concept of GDP, economic value and growth etc, and the impact of different activity on the same, just believe that this SIMPLE statement, could save everything

buy local if you can

[hootar]

Originally Posted by Shonky.

it is very, very simple, rest assured

simple concepts often require the most explanation, so your assessment of his post is very flawed

if everyone bought local when they could, then the rest would work itself out

governments would be forced to follow the publics preferences or risk being voted out

retailers and producers would be forced to use local stuff themselves because they'd know they wont sell as much if they don't

companies wouldn't move manufacturing offshore, as they know people would stop buying


your statements about foreign ownership are equally flawed

from an economic perspective foreign ownership of local manufacturing is a wonderful thing

the manufacturing process is where the wealth is created, not the delivery of profit to owners; whilst its nice if profit stays local it is nowhere near as important

this is because economic value, measured in GDP, is created by value added

the tiny amount of profit that flows offshore pales compared to the overall revenue that the industry creates, most of which stays in our economy as value added

all the intermediate and primary goods purchased, all the supporting industries kept in business, supply chains both up and downstream, all the people employed in the actual manufacture and support, onshore management structures, onshore admin, onshore hr

this is all good stuff for the economy

you are in fact actually part of the problem

you are creating disinformation, and making readers dumber, by try to distract from someone's well intentioned attempt to educate people to create better outcomes

you should try reading a book before you gob off about stuff you know nothing about

if you don't understand the concept of GDP, economic value and growth etc, and the impact of different activity on the same, just believe that this SIMPLE statement, could save everything

buy local if you can

I don't always agree with what you say shonky but I'm 100% behind on this one.
Itd, big damo and you are right on the money.

It's the same sort of thing our farmers are facing. Today it's the dairy industry. Not to long ago it was the fruit and grain growers. Before them the sheep and beef farmers. Tomorrow it will be the poultry farmers.

If like our industrial industries we don't support all our primary producers then they too will struggle to exist.

In the agricultural sector I know there is more forces at play in this, eg Aussie dollar and world supply and demand, climates etc but It's time we all realised that when you buy Australian you support Australians. If we follow that rule then it will surely help and as you said, Goverments, Coles, woollies and greedy company executives will soon get the hint. And all us Australians will be a lot better off.

[XWGT]

Sorry while you may get strong local profits you get zero innovation or research and development as companies are lazy without competition.
Do you seriously think FPV would have spent $40 million developing the BOSS 335 if HSV didn't exist? We'd still be driving 185 kw Windsor and be told we where lucky!
The old nationalists economic argument is great for the heart strings but the global economy has proven it to be a fairies tale over and over in the last 20 years.

[ebv8]

i watched the history of holden on youtube (Quantum TV show 1986), it showed through the life of holden up to 1986 they struggled pretty much every year, and from what i got from it, it was the yanks wanting us to make more money and do things their way.
we couldn't have have the manufacturing they had due to our lack of volume of sales
the yanks set the prices, the yanks made all the decisions.

We need an Australian company to take over and start building falcodores and torantinas, a RWD mid and large car with a ute and wagon and keep all the money and decisions here.....but that just my dream it won't ever work

[Vesper Martini]

Originally Posted by CyberWasp

At least Ford hasn't given up on the Territory.
Instead of employing a whole factory of people to make and assemble them locally, they will employ a person or two to remove Edge badges and replace them with Territory ones as they arrive off the boat.

mm I don't like it That's the Holden way of doing things.

http://www.motoring.com.au/edge-to-t...rritory-47762/

I'm not hung up on nameplates and would prefer it to have the correct Edge name.

But I guess if it did it would stop all the people thinking the Everest is the Territory replacement. FFS you can still Buy a Territory new

[tranquilized]

Originally Posted by Shonky.

it is very, very simple, rest assured

simple concepts often require the most explanation, so your assessment of his post is very flawed

if everyone bought local when they could, then the rest would work itself out

governments would be forced to follow the publics preferences or risk being voted out

retailers and producers would be forced to use local stuff themselves because they'd know they wont sell as much if they don't

companies wouldn't move manufacturing offshore, as they know people would stop buying


your statements about foreign ownership are equally flawed

from an economic perspective foreign ownership of local manufacturing is a wonderful thing

the manufacturing process is where the wealth is created, not the delivery of profit to owners; whilst its nice if profit stays local it is nowhere near as important

this is because economic value, measured in GDP, is created by value added

the tiny amount of profit that flows offshore pales compared to the overall revenue that the industry creates, most of which stays in our economy as value added

all the intermediate and primary goods purchased, all the supporting industries kept in business, supply chains both up and downstream, all the people employed in the actual manufacture and support, onshore management structures, onshore admin, onshore hr

this is all good stuff for the economy

you are in fact actually part of the problem

you are creating disinformation, and making readers dumber, by try to distract from someone's well intentioned attempt to educate people to create better outcomes

you should try reading a book before you gob off about stuff you know nothing about

if you don't understand the concept of GDP, economic value and growth etc, and the impact of different activity on the same, just believe that this SIMPLE statement, could save everything

buy local if you can

Where do I start....

Firstly, you're completely right - if everyone bought local at every opportunity then the market would follow suit. That's basic free market economics.

But focusing on the auto industry, why do you think it is that people haven't been buying local? Fickle tastes, buyers blindly following trends buying inferior cars? That may be true, but it's a free market. The manufacturers that adapt and shift to suit the market will survive, the ones that don't, won't.

Ford and Holden chose not to adapt - they kept building cars that haven't been popular for over a decade. But it wasn't Ford Australia or Holden that made that decision - it was made for them in Detroit.

Ford have wanted to pull out of Australian manufacturing for decades, that's no secret. They weren't able to however because the local product was so popular (which backs up your & LTD's theory) Ford Australia even convinced Detroit to be allowed to build the Territory, an example of adapting to a changing marketplace. All good so far.

But as the market continued to fragment and evolve, FOA actually stripped back their offerings and froze development on the Territory. Detroit knew exactly what they were doing - offer less choice, and less popular ones at that. Local sales predictably nose dived. This allowed them to pull out of local manufacture. What else would they do, sales are dismal! No one's buying local! Ford in Detroit get what they wanted all along - a cheaper place to build cars. (And this relates back to the government aspect LTD talked about in his post. I could talk about that for hours as well, I've read a few books...)

Why all the smoke and mirrors and boardroom scheming? Why not just close it down? Transitions like this are tough. Closing a factory shines a bad light on the brand. It has to be managed very carefully.

If everyone kept buying Falcon sedans, wagons, utes, vans, Fairlaines, LTD's, and Territory's in 1990's numbers, they would have kept building them. But should the buying public really be blamed for not buying a car that's utterly unsuitable for their needs? If we had our own industry, locally owned, they would have adapted to the current market, but FOA were never allowed to.

Forget about where the profits (and losses) flow from our foreign owned auto industry. For the purpose of this discussion that isn't so relevant. What is relevant is where the big product decisions were made, and why they were made. Understand that and you'll understand why Ford are really giving up on Falcon and Territory.

[malazn mafia]

Originally Posted by Crazy Dazz

Part of the contributing problem, is that once Ford sold off Jag, AM, & Volvo, and moved all their big NA cars to FWD, they nolonger support a large RWD platform. To the extent that FA had to develop their own platform, the E8, for the FG. That was never going to be sustainable long-term. There was talk at one point of moving the Mustang to a common RWD platform, which would have kept development alive, or even simply building a 4 door saloon on the Mustang platform. But I can imagine the Mustang development division would be powerful and would have jealously guarded their crown jewels.

Ultimately, Ford have decided to retire the Falcon nameplate for socio-political reasons, and I applaud that. From FA's perspective, the current large RWD sedan will be replaced by the Mondeo/Fusion, a largish FWD sedan.
The Terry will be replaced by the Everest and possibly a RHD version of the Flex or Explorer. (Which may even carry the Territory name.)

Ironically Falcon was donor car for original Mustang, which makes Falcon father of Mustang. It's a shame the two could not continue side by side, even if Falcon was no longer Australian made..

[malazn mafia]

Originally Posted by ebv8

i watched the history of holden on youtube (Quantum TV show 1986), it showed through the life of holden up to 1986 they struggled pretty much every year, and from what i got from it, it was the yanks wanting us to make more money and do things their way.
we couldn't have have the manufacturing they had due to our lack of volume of sales
the yanks set the prices, the yanks made all the decisions.

We need an Australian company to take over and start building falcodores and torantinas, a RWD mid and large car with a ute and wagon and keep all the money and decisions here.....but that just my dream it won't ever work

But it seems Australia's population has little to no national pride or patriotism. They wouldn't give a flying proverbial about whether they were buying Australian made, or some cheap Thai, Korean, Chinese overpriced factory second assembled with slave labour. Nobody was ever moved to tears by our national anthem, can't recall the last time someone draped themselves in our national flag. People of ethnic origin often identify themselves by their home country, and don't even call themselves Australian. Australia once was the best place to live, but then unions, greenies, political correctness and greed brought this country to its knees and we have lost many things which once made this country great, Falcon being one of them.

[SVR73]

Originally Posted by Big Damo

I'm a distributor for REDARC products, they're a South Australian company who designs and manufactures automotive related electronics right here in Australia:

https://www.redarc.com.au/

Also I'm a distributor for Century Batteries and stock wise I'm one of the top two businesses who carry biggest range of their products in Victoria:

http://www.cyb.com.au/home

They're locally designed and made products, but everyone starts squealing about price, yes REDARC products are more expensive than their competitors, but its good stuff and a lot of it is made locally.

Same thing with Century batteries, if its got a blue and yellow case, its made in Brisbane, and they've been making batteries since 1926.

But again price, people don't want to pay what it costs for locally manufactured products, they squeal ***** and cry about it because they can save $20 by buying some cheap BS from Thailand, its 'too expensive' to buy locally made products.

But they're the first to whinge and complain if their job gets outsourced.

Its always an up hill battle with these people I face daily.

One of my customers today told me the caravan manufacturer who made his caravan said to him he doesn't use REDARC products because they're too expensive, well mofo why should I buy a caravan you make when I can get some Chinese person to make it for 1/10th of the cost you can?

Well said. The quality buyers in Australia are few and I'm one of them and I see the value in a more expensive, better quality product
Some of today's generation just want cheap, all they hear on the radio every day is cheap cheap cheap. But a lot of it is crap stuff
It started with the rug sellers then harvey Norman, now it's national tiles and that frank ******.

All they care about is the price and many people just don't think about what it's costing them.
Like buying home brand milk instead of Paul's or the really good stuff from farmers markets
To most it's justmilk, no difference. To me, I like the quality stuff and supporting local dairy farmers
In my industry, a detailer can buy A really cheap polisher for fifty bucks
But can he do work as good as me with eleven Japanese and German made machines that are built to last and one cost me 800 dollars and is the worlds most advanced of its type. The latest ones are built like tanks and worth every dollar I paid for them. Yet some would rather buy ten fifty dollar polishers than me buying one to last as long

My work will be superior, faster, eliminates the need for cutting compounds and same price or only a little more

The Asian tv manufacturers killed the tv and video service industry with their, we no like service speech at a convention several years ago. It's gone from make a great product that lasts years or decades and building a reputation of reliability to make it cheap and make them buy it over and over again