Coyote XR8 still a year away - Page 2

**Polyal** · 28-01-2011, 06:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SM1DY

Because it's a Coyote

Exactly, and Ford can get away with doing a straight engine dump because even though it might have more tech than the GS, the GS should still be quicker because of the increased torque; and having the charger gives it a bit more "street" cred.

Mind you Id like to see the GS dropped once the improved GT-HP is released. If HSV want to do povo-pack-leftover-Pontiac specials then let them; the GS is a nice car bit devalues FPV IMO. Its such an orphan car, not really a FPV, more than a Ford etc.

The marketplace really is flooded with choice. Holden have SS's that you can upgrade to SSV or redline. Ford have little choice other than the GS which for some is to basic, or a big jump to the GT.

I reckon the XR8 will slip back in nicely.

Venomous1 · 28-01-2011, 06:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by banarcus

"But we are the 6cyl car company. We'll sell you any car you want as long as it is a sedan, has a 6cyl motor and an automatic gearbox."

This pretty much. Disappointing.

stang65 · 28-01-2011, 06:24 PM

Sorry Smidy I know it`s a better motor but I wouldn`t upgrade just because it`s a coyote, I would upgrade because it`s a coyote with more balls than what my car currently has. I suppose everybody has a choice.

Joe5619 · 28-01-2011, 06:27 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by stang65

I would have bought an xr8 when I bought my xr6 turbo, the only reason I didn`t was because the turbo was quicker.

If the xr8 was quicker I would have bought it and I bought new and I know alot of guys with xr6 turbo`s that thought the same way I did.

Make that 2 people.. I was the same

SM1DY · 28-01-2011, 06:27 PM

Double post

Joe5619 · 28-01-2011, 06:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by stang65

yeah but the last model xr8 was 290kw why would you upgrade or buy a coyote xr8 if its putting out the same power as the previous model.

for all the same reasons why poeple keep updating to new I6 Falcons when there has been no increase for mnay many years!!

SM1DY · 28-01-2011, 06:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Polyal

The marketplace really is flooded with choice. Holden have SS's that you can upgrade to SSV or redline. Ford have little choice other than the GS which for some is to basic, or a big jump to the GT.

I reckon the XR8 will slip back in nicely.

And perhaps a XR8 Sprint and let the XR8 play the supporting entry level V8 role like the SS does with the SS-V?

I might be getting a bit greedy now.

stang65 · 28-01-2011, 06:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Joe5619

Make that 2 people.. I was the same

Alot of people still bought the xr8 for the sound , they did ound good,but I couldn`t live with myself buying a car that was slower when I could afford the quicker one and at the time the turbo was cheaper too.

fou_bleu · 28-01-2011, 06:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by stang65

I would have bought an xr8 when I bought my xr6 turbo, the only reason I didn't was because the turbo was quicker.

If the xr8 was quicker I would have bought it and I bought new and I know a lot of guys with xr6 turbo`s that thought the same way I did.

So if the Coyote was somehow slower than the Turbo, would you still buy it? ;)

**Polyal** · 28-01-2011, 06:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 4RD4TW

So if the Coyote was somehow slower than the Turbo, would you still buy it? ;)

It wouldn't be, but yes. The performance between the BF/FG XR6T and XR8 was very close, almost line ball, the XR8 was marginally quicker in ZF form. I know some drag slips here will tell a different story here but I mean real world driving stock cars.

Quote:

Originally Posted by stang65

Alot of people still bought the xr8 for the sound , they did ound good,but I couldn`t live with myself buying a car that was slower when I could afford the quicker one and at the time the turbo was cheaper too.

This is true, no better example than that of the FPV GT prior Miami aswell.

The performance of the XR6T VS a Coyote XR8 would be pretty close, the XR8 would produce more power but the torque would be pretty even. Still think the XR8 would pip it though, and thats all it needs to do.

People dont buy a XR8 for outright performance, they buy them for affordability, usability and feel. Those who want real mumbo head for FPV, some are happy with the experience (plus you can mod them later if you like and the Coyote responds very well).

Ford made many fans by selling a V8 for the people, this is now missing in their line up.

Fireblade · 28-01-2011, 06:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Joe5619

Simple!! XR8 & XR6T should be line priced.. At that is about mid 40s... Not sure how you think current GS & old XR8 are priced the same?? What does a GS go for?

Re-read my post, never said they were priced the same, just saying you have to take the GS pricing into considering they are the FPV equivelant.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Polyal

Ford made many fans by selling a V8 for the people, this is now missing in their line up.

Considering the XR8 was the only V8 mainstream available for many years in Fords lineup until FPV come along and built the GT, this and the XR6T has killed XR8 sales.

stang65 · 28-01-2011, 06:44 PM

Nope....SEEMS HARsh I would luv a V8 especially with a supercharger,but we are buying performance vehicles not luxury cars. The whole reason people are excited about the coyote is because we finally have a v8 with balls.

If they just released the coyote and it had the same power as the 5.4 do you really think anybody would really care? It`s the fact that it`s come out with a supercharger and like the turbo`s should offer some serious bang for buck.(as well it`s meant to be a better motor)

Just to make on thing clear I do love my turbo, but I would not hesitate to upgrade to a coyote if it was quicker if the time was right (financially).

**Polyal** · 28-01-2011, 06:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by stang65

Nope....SEEMS HARsh I would luv a V8 especially with a supercharger,but we are buying performance vehicles not luxury cars. The whole reason people are excited about the coyote is because we finally have a v8 with balls.

If they just released the coyote and it had the same power as the 5.4 do you really think anybody would really care? It`s the fact that it`s come out with a supercharger and like the turbo`s should offer some serious bang for buck.(as well it`s meant to be a better motor)

Just to make on thing clear I do love my turbo, but I would not hesitate to upgrade to a coyote if it was quicker if the time was right (financially).

But you brought a I6T, why not the GS?

You might be confused with what the 5.0L US Spec Coyote really is, 2011 Ford Mustang GT, 412 hp (307 kW) @ 6500 rpm, 390 lb·ft (529 N·m) @ 4250 rpm. It aint lacking anything.

It is NOTHING like the 5.4 and it is a brilliant engine, perfect for the XR8 and can be had by mere mortals like us for $9-10k on your door. Im sure FoA could get a good bulk deal..LOL

b2tf · 28-01-2011, 06:48 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Polyal

Put me down as a buyer, but 2012..come on...I dont know if I want to wait that long.

No way I would resort to buying a SS ..cant believe people even think of it.

As long as its the full monty 5.0 then I think it will be worth the wait, and Id happily wager a stock 5.0 coyote will be a better drive than a 5.4 290/302/315.

Not everybody holds out, as has been mentioned in this thread what about those on lease plans for their cars etc. Believe it or not Holden actually do make an alright car and people do like them.

Watch me get shot down for saying that.

Nikked · 28-01-2011, 06:49 PM

*Insert Something to do with the taurus here*

Fireblade · 28-01-2011, 06:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by b2tf

Not everybody holds out, as has been mentioned in this thread what about those on lease plans for their cars etc. Believe it or not Holden actually do make an alright car and people do like them.

Watch me get shot down for saying that.

I agree whole heartedly B2TF, I can see why people buy Holdens, and sales stats tell the story, if they were that rubbish as some claim why do they sell so many?

stang65 · 28-01-2011, 06:51 PM

GS wasn`t out when I bought my turbo, It`s only a Ba xr6 turbo that I bought new, I know the coyote is a brilliant engine.

stang65 · 28-01-2011, 06:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by F6 FOON

I agree whole heartedly B2TF, I can see why people buy Holdens, and sales stats tell the story, if they were that rubbish as some claim why do they sell so many?

Thats easy "It`s called marketing" and holden a fantastic at it.

Fireblade · 28-01-2011, 06:54 PM

And how much have you had to do with Holden's? obviously not enough

stang65 · 28-01-2011, 06:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by F6 FOON

And how much have you had to do with Holden's? obviously not enough

?????????????????????????????????????????????????? ?????????????????????????

flappist · 28-01-2011, 06:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Polyal

Hardly harsh.

What does it matter if someone brought on in the last 5 years? The XR8 is an important car for FORD. The XR8, in ute form, was always a good seller, in particular for tradies who actually wanted a V8 ute that could be used.

And shock horror, there are always new people entering the marketplace, and even more shocking is that some of them mightnt want a FPV, or even a car that has FI.

Whats the GS sell for, $56k I thought, AFAIK the FG XR8 was under $50k. Reference here:

http://www.carsales.com.au/car-resea...d=12AA16143D26

http://www.carsales.com.au/car-resea...d=12AA16143D26

And we all know you could get a FG XR8 new for less than that. There is a big enough gap for the XR8 to return and be the aspirational car for the FORD fleet.

There is onle ONE sort of car that is important to FORD and surprisingly it is exactly the same car that is important to Holden, Toyota and even Ferarri......it is a car that sells.

I seemed to have missed all the "I bought one" posts........

Why is it that no matter what is offered it is never enough, is always wrong and something else would be the true mesiah?

4Vman · 28-01-2011, 06:57 PM

A couple of points;
1) in auto form the FG XR8 is quicker than the Auto SS end of story.
2) Holden have been very clever in marketing every seperate major option and appointment level as a seperate model, SV8 became SS, SS became SSv, Redline etc..

Ford just provided improvenents AS options, resale gets smashed when you do this.
The base XR8 is the price all XR8's get measured against, add luxury and tech packs with 19" wheels and it pushes it over 50K yet everyone thinks an XR8 is only worth 43K new....
All 3 of my XR8's were high 40's to low 50's new.
Pity we wont get an XR8 soon, maybe the success of the GS has made that less painful though...

Fireblade · 28-01-2011, 06:58 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by stang65

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Disregard, my head was elsewhere...

b2tf · 28-01-2011, 06:58 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by stang65

Thats easy "It`s called marketing" and holden a fantastic at it.

Actually I believe it is called 'choices'

You can option a V8 in Holden SS, Berlina, Calais, Statesman (have i missed any?) and thats before you even look at HSV.

Not everybody's budget extends to FPV and HSV territory but there are still those who love a nice V8. I am one of them.

If I dont know much about cars but like a good sounding V8 (and yes people like this exist) and I go to a Ford dealer and they tell me 'sorry you need to wait till 2012 and we MIGHT have something for you - or go to FPV', then wander across the road to Holden and they say 'take your pick' - where am I more likely to spend my money?

We always point the finger at Holden's marketing for their sales but I reckon the sheer choice they offer buyers is why there are a lot more LS2's and 3's than BOSS and Coyote V8's on the road.

stang65 · 28-01-2011, 07:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by F6 FOON

Disregard, my head was elsewhere...

All Good

Fireblade · 28-01-2011, 07:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by b2tf

We always point the finger at Holden's marketing for their sales but I reckon the sheer choice they offer buyers is why there are a lot more LS2's and 3's than BOSS and Coyote V8's on the road.

And given those choices most Holden buyers go a lot of the options, not many I see round have cloth instead of leather and the tech appointments also, you do get some pov packs but as a majority they buy the loaded packs, which lines Holdens pockets more and keeps them giving buyers these choices.

Take the GS for example, brembos aren't even an option, because people were buying GT's and not ticking the brembo option box so now they are left off the list and that list of left offs is quite long.

Joe5619 · 28-01-2011, 07:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Polyal

But you brought a I6T, why not the GS?

The price differnce between the 2 is 10K!!! Very good reason to buy I6T...

**Polyal** · 28-01-2011, 07:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by b2tf

Actually I believe it is called 'choices'

You can option a V8 in Holden SS, Berlina, Calais, Statesman (have i missed any?) and thats before you even look at HSV.

Not everybody's budget extends to FPV and HSV territory but there are still those who love a nice V8. I am one of them.

If I dont know much about cars but like a good sounding V8 (and yes people like this exist) and I go to a Ford dealer and they tell me 'sorry you need to wait till 2012 and we MIGHT have something for you - or go to FPV', then wander across the road to Holden and they say 'take your pick' - where am I more likely to spend my money?

We always point the finger at Holden's marketing for their sales but I reckon the sheer choice they offer buyers is why there are a lot more LS2's and 3's than BOSS and Coyote V8's on the road.

GREAT POST.

Holden sell more cars because the give people what they want. Now whether that is profitable or not is another thread but the fact remains they are loyal(ish) to their customers.

Ford on the other hand dictate what we "want". Completely different ways of going about business.

Quote:

Originally Posted by flappist

There is onle ONE sort of car that is important to FORD and surprisingly it is exactly the same car that is important to Holden, Toyota and even Ferarri......it is a car that sells.

I seemed to have missed all the "I bought one" posts........

Why is it that no matter what is offered it is never enough, is always wrong and something else would be the true mesiah?

Yeap Ford need more sales, so how does leaving out a good selling car work with that equation? Ford currently dont sell a XR8 because they have shot themselves in the foot with the GS. They can hardly offer a further detuned GS can they...

I have no idea what you are talking about with the "brought" comments.

I can reply to your last section by saying, "why is it that Ford think we will fold and accept what they tell us we want?". Ford fo alot of things right, but its scenarios like this, and then fuzzy grey answers they give that create confusion and ultimately lead to people shopping elsewhere.

Dont tell me that all the people who were previously buying XR8's have taken the plunge and gone with the GS.

Fireblade · 28-01-2011, 07:16 PM

XR8 sales were not good, much like wagon sales before it, if it doesn't sell why make it?

We Ford Fans/buyers dictate the market to Ford, the salse of cars, the options that come with, all tell Ford what we want.

**Polyal** · 28-01-2011, 07:21 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by F6 FOON

XR8 sales were not good, much like wagon sales before it, if it doesn't sell why make it?

We Ford Fans/buyers dictate the market to Ford, the salse of cars, the options that come with, all tell Ford what we want.

Compared to its internal and external competition the XR8 didn't stack up that well even though overall it was a competent car. This forum is a prime example, look how many people jumped ship to the I6T once the XR8 didn't stack up. Previous to this the XR8 was a good seller.

If its even remotely profitable then why wouldn't Ford do it, a sale from GM is better than giving a free hit.

IMO this engine would freshen up the XR8's image much like the new 5.0 has done for the GT.