Government to probe 'killer' Volkswagens

[stevz]

So much for Euro engineering and quality....


http://theage.drive.com.au/motor-new...531-2nhgu.html

The federal government has launched an investigation into possible faults in popular models of Volkswagens which have led to motorists experiencing a frightening and sudden loss of acceleration while driving their cars.

The Department of Infrastructure and Transport confirmed late on Friday that it was probing ''reports of VWs decelerating and is liaising closely with Volkswagen Australia''.

Meanwhile, Fairfax Media was flooded on Friday by more than 50 concerned drivers who had read about the case of Melissa Ryan, a 32-year-old bride-to-be who was killed by a truck on the Monash Freeway after her Golf appeared to suffer a dramatic and inexplicable loss of speed.

The Victorian Coroner is investigating Ms Ryan's death, which could be due to vehicle malfunction, driver error, truck driver fault or the combination of these factors. Volkswagen Australia has said there is no evidence to suggest her car was at fault.
Advertisement

But Ms Ryan's story, and a Fairfax Media investigation into a number of issues that have sparked recalls in China, Japan and the United States, sparked a big response on Friday among Volkswagen customers.

At least 55 people spoke of their loss of faith in their vehicles after they were travelling on busy highways only to feel their cars ''just die''. The incidents occurred from Brisbane to the Blue Mountains, in suburban Melbourne and on the Sydney Harbour Bridge.

Most incidents involved the Golf and Passat models, both manual and automatics, and the problems included issues with the vehicle's software, switching suddenly into ''limp home mode'', the failure of diesel injectors, the immobiliser systems and the automatic transmission (the high-tech direct-shift gearboxes, or DSG).

Many said that after the incidents no fault showed up on the car log and some mechanics were unsure why the cars were experiencing sudden deceleration. Others had to pay thousands of dollars in out-of-pocket expenses for repairs and replacement parts.

One Sydney man, who declined to be named, took legal action against Volkswagen after his wife was almost killed on a freeway when their 2010 Golf automatic ''ground to a halt'' amid traffic. The couple could not afford to continue the legal action.

In Sydney, Di Webster said that on Wednesday evening she was driving towards the city. As she approached the entrance to the Sydney Harbour Bridge in her automatic 2006/07-model VW Golf, a yellow light appeared on her dashboard and suddenly ''the car died''.

''It was quite bizarre. It was moving. I just couldn't accelerate,'' Ms Webster said. Fortunately there were no vehicles around her at the time and she was able to exit into the city and pull over, where she called the NRMA.

''I was really lucky I was where I was. If I had a truck bearing down behind me, God knows what would have happened,'' she said.

Golf driver Patrick Walsh, whose car stopped several times in busy traffic last year said: ''Everyone expects the best of an iconic German vehicle [but] I'm afraid it failed me twice early in its life in tricky situations and that's not good enough.''

Jetta owner Geof Sargent said he wanted his case to be considered by the Victorian Coroner because ''on two occasions that's where my wife could have ended up''.

As Fairfax Media reported on Friday, Volkswagen has recalled some of its models in China and Japan for issues with the DSG, while Volkswagen of America has replaced parts free.

Volkswagen Australia has refused calls for a recall here, saying the Chinese DSGs were made locally and the DSGs in Australia are European. However, the company has extended the warranty for the part.

Volkswagen has a service ''campaign'' related to a problem with the diesel injectors but many customers do not appear to know about it.

Volkswagen did not return Fairfax Media's calls yesterday.

[mik]

Stopping dead on a busy freeway full of cars could be a bit exciting, vw needs to get on top of this one pronto.

[stevz]

A link to the incident mentioned above

http://www.theage.com.au/victoria/ca...527-2n79v.html

[2011G6E]

I'm sorry...but I always wonder about things like this and what the driver was doing. After all, we all remember the "suddenly accelerating Toyotas" that were traced back to driver error mostly, and the one tragic instance of a Lexus driver in the USA who just kept barrelling along at higher and higher speeds with his family on board and talking to cops on the phone, until he crashed, cruise control still locked on apparently...people did ask at the time if it was a true "uncontrollable runaway" why he didn't jam on the brakes as hard as possible, knock it out of gear, or just turn off the frigging key...after all, brake systems on cars are one of the few areas that are banned from having an electrical connection like some steering and throttle systems...there has to be a physical connection between pedal and brakes.

[malazn mafia]

Originally Posted by 2011G6E

I'm sorry...but I always wonder about things like this and what the driver was doing. After all, we all remember the "suddenly accelerating Toyotas" that were traced back to driver error mostly, and the one tragic instance of a Lexus driver in the USA who just kept barrelling along at higher and higher speeds with his family on board and talking to cops on the phone, until he crashed, cruise control still locked on apparently...people did ask at the time if it was a true "uncontrollable runaway" why he didn't jam on the brakes as hard as possible, knock it out of gear, or just turn off the frigging key...after all, brake systems on cars are one of the few areas that are banned from having an electrical connection like some steering and throttle systems...there has to be a physical connection between pedal and brakes.

Maybe I can understand some people do not react well to danger and freeze up or experience tunnel vision or lapse of judgement. I can almost guarantee the Lexus and Camry incidents in the USA were floor mat related and they would have lived if the trans was simply flicked to neutral.

[Buntz]

Originally Posted by malazn mafia

Maybe I can understand some people do not react well to danger and freeze up or experience tunnel vision or lapse of judgement. I can almost guarantee the Lexus and Camry incidents in the USA were floor mat related and they would have lived if the trans was simply flicked to neutral.

I agree completely. Some people have no education about how their car works... but they can be licensed to drive one.

I remember a seven news report about some guys Ford Explorer here in Aus (was it in Perth... maybe), the Explorers CC stuck on, and he couldn't deactivate it. He called the police and they cleared the highway for him to do an emergency stop. He just kept circling the ring road.

All that he had to do was put the car in neutral and pull off onto the emergency stopping lane. I couldn't believe what I was hearing. But people out there really don't know how to handle their vehicles.

[jpd80]

Not the same thing,

he court heard Ms Ryan was driving at about 100km/h while talking to a friend on a Bluetooth device connecting her mobile phone at the time her car was hit, but that in the seconds before the impact, her car rapidly dropped in speed.

The truck driver behind her, Ivan Mumford, insisted the brake lights on Ms Ryan's car did not come on before the crash, and that in the instant before he hit his brakes, the gap between the car and his 25-metre truck dropped from about 40 metres to three.

Ms Ryan's car hit the wire fencing at 31km/h, the court heard.

Mr Mumford, a truck driver of 34 years' experience, said he had seen Ms Ryan's brake lights working when the flow of traffic had earlier slowed, but likened the drop in speed of the Volkswagen to the driver pulling "on the handbrake without the lights coming on".

Mr Mumford, who appeared via videolink, said he was also desperate to find out what caused the deceleration.

Read more: http://www.theage.com.au/victoria/ca...#ixzz2UszvM2a8

[DJM83]

It's an extreme case but it's not like any other car makers don't have their faults. Nice dig at imports

[GTP-814]

Originally Posted by 2011G6E

I'm sorry...but I always wonder about things like this and what the driver was doing. After all, we all remember the "suddenly accelerating Toyotas" that were traced back to driver error mostly, and the one tragic instance of a Lexus driver in the USA who just kept barrelling along at higher and higher speeds with his family on board and talking to cops on the phone, until he crashed, cruise control still locked on apparently...people did ask at the time if it was a true "uncontrollable runaway" why he didn't jam on the brakes as hard as possible, knock it out of gear, or just turn off the frigging key...after all, brake systems on cars are one of the few areas that are banned from having an electrical connection like some steering and throttle systems...there has to be a physical connection between pedal and brakes.

we have a Golf & to come back out of neutral you have to have your foot o the brake depressed & i think stationery to get back into drive

[SS_01]

Originally Posted by GTP-814

we have a Golf & to come back out of neutral you have to have your foot o the brake depressed & i think stationery to get back into drive

No you don't, you may have another issue with your car if that's the case.

Originally Posted by ESP

That's what the marketing guys at VW will tell you.
Indonesian tolerances within 2% of experienced german manufacturers.....really.

I use to work within the Volkswagen fold, and unless its changed within the last 18 months, these are the tolerances set by Volkswagen and tested regularly.

Most likely the issue will be arising from the wiring loom, which sends a pulse through the vehicle every 30 milliseconds to determine issues with the car. With the golf, the most common version to go into limp home mode was the 118TSI.

As stipulated by others, this isn't only happening in Volkswagens, it often occurs in other makes and models.

[Silver Ghia]

And here is an article by our old mate in todays Herald-Sun: http://www.carsguide.com.au/news-and...lated_to_death

VW technical faults ‘completely unrelated’ to death
By Joshua Dowling Carsguide 31 May 2013


VW says diesel and auto faults not related to Melbourne fatality.

Volkswagen Australia says technical faults with some of its diesel engines and automatic cars are “completely unrelated” to the death of a Volkswagen Golf driver in Melbourne, whose car was struck from behind by a truck in February 2011.
The car involved in that incident had a petrol engine and a manual transmission. Reports at the time said the car had slowed suddenly to 20km/h while in the fast lane. The truck driver reported not seeing any brake lights.

Volkswagen Australia spokesman Karl Gehling told News Limited: “We’re disappointed some media have ignored the details of the case and chosen to link completely unrelated issues. The examples are not relevant.”

Volkswagen Australia has told News Limited that some early model diesel cars are being called back to dealerships across Australia to have their engine’s injectors replaced to prevent the vehicles from slowing suddenly or shifting into “limp home mode”.

The self-contained safety measure is common on most new cars with engines controlled by computer software, and are designed to prompt drivers to take their car to a dealership while not leaving them stranded.

Three years ago Volkswagen Australia called back about 8000 “twin-charge” petrol engines fitted to the Golf because rough idling would prevent the car from driving off.

But the engine in the car at the centre of the investigation -- a high performance Golf GTI -- does not have the type of petrol engine at the centre of the earlier recall. It was also equipped with a manual transmission.

Overseas, Volkswagen has recalled almost 500,000 cars equipped with its unique “DSG” automatic gearbox because of quality concerns and uneven acceleration and delayed gear changes, rather than sudden deceleration.

However the issues have been brought into the spotlight following a Coroner’s inquest this week into the death the Volkswagen Golf driver in Melbourne two years ago. The coroner is investigating what caused the crash and led to her death and will release the findings in July.

Another Volkswagen Australia spokesman, Kurt McGuiness, told media earlier the company currently has no plans for any new recalls. “Volkswagen conducts vehicle recalls in conjunction with the relevant federal government bodies. At this time we do not plan to announce a recall,” he said.

“Rapid deceleration is not an issue widely observed or reported with any Volkswagen vehicles. However, should any of our customers have cause for concern with their Volkswagen vehicle, we urge them to contact our customer care team.”

This reporter is on Twitter: @JoshuaDowling

[malazn mafia]

Wouldn't the logical thing be to turn ignition off while car in motion, trans in neutral then start car again while rolling? Worked twice in the BA I had, which had a ETC fault intermittent, at highway speeds sometimes. Also once in a new corolla, had the car accelerate uncontrollably towards a concrete divider while merging. Put trans in neutral, swerved up the on-ramp and killed the Ignition while engine on limiter. Noticed the pedal was depressed and it was the edge of floor mat wedged against side of accelerator pedal. Could not believe my eyes at the time and could not replicate the situation again no matter how hard I tried. Maybe every driver should be trained in what to do in a freak acceleration/deceleration incident.

[66GT]

slightly off topic - but my 74 kombi also suffers from a hugh drop in/loss of power, I always assumed in was part of the VW "experience". So if I incorrectly fit some Toyota floor mats I will have the opportunity to live life on the edge of the law by being able to drive faster than my current top speed of 60kmh. Here I've been thinking that only an engine replacement with something better (ie. turbo Subi) would fix this.

[new2ford]

When I saw this thread title I thought somebody had dragged out an old item about the original Beetle.

VW's latest-model gagetry can be known to be quirky. That's why everybody (including our local Ford/VW dealer service!) says to buy the Skoda equivalent which uses proven stuff from the previous model cycle. That's why their reliability is better.

[Sioso]

Our company has 2 x 2011 Golfs both with DSG 7 speeds, the 5 door hatch had it's clutch replaced at 31,000k's and the Golf wagons clutch is now going with just 11,000k's on the clock.
I was driving the wagon last weekend (1.4L TSI) along the freeway when all of a sudden a big plume of smoke came out the back of the car, that big that it covered the highway in smoke.
It disappeared as quickly as it came and I could find no trace of what caused it.
I have also experienced the car refusing to engage reverse, have to turn the car off and restart.........no more VW's for us.
I do find these stories easy to believe.

[Pinkbits]

Not just confined to one make either.
My company car, a 2011 D40 Navara was continuingly going in to limp mode at any time.
It would happen at any time & under different driving conditions. Each time it happened I reported it to my dealer only to be told there was not fault code showing.
The straw that broke the camels back was when it lost power midway through a roundabout & I was nearly t-boned.
They had it for a week as I told them it was now a OH&S matter & that the vehicle was unsafe. They told me they had tried to replicate the fault & had re flashed it three times to no avail (no loan car either!).
It did I again soon after & I took it back & demanded someone from Nissan customer service contact me as I wanted a replacement car.
They scanned it on the spot & funny enough it came back with a fault code which indicated loss of fuel pressure.
The warranty claim had to be approved before they would touch it (it took three weeks).
So far it hasn't happened again.
It has also happened with another D40 but not as often & both cars were purchased from the same dealer at the same time.

[stevz]

One would think that if you were driving down the freeway at 100 and your engine cut out the car would simply keep rolling, but in these cases it seems like there is a braking force applied as well, so there is a lot more to this than what meets the eye.

[Pedro]

Originally Posted by stevz

One would think that if you were driving down the freeway at 100 and your engine cut out the car would simply keep rolling, but in these cases it seems like there is a braking force applied as well, so there is a lot more to this than what meets the eye.

Well one may think that, but that's not how it works.
While competing in Sprints at QR in my BF F6 some years back, the 6 speed ZF cried enough and went into limp mode just as I was approaching the final corner before pit straight. I had just overtaken a Porsche and was still well before the braking markers when it went into limp and decelerated quickly. I check the rear-view and saw a Porsche rapidly approaching my backside ... fortunately the driver was awake and had to swerve violently to avoid a collision.

[Franco Cozzo]

Originally Posted by Pinkbits

Not just confined to one make either.
My company car, a 2011 D40 Navara was continuingly going in to limp mode at any time.
It would happen at any time & under different driving conditions. Each time it happened I reported it to my dealer only to be told there was not fault code showing.
The straw that broke the camels back was when it lost power midway through a roundabout & I was nearly t-boned.
They had it for a week as I told them it was now a OH&S matter & that the vehicle was unsafe. They told me they had tried to replicate the fault & had re flashed it three times to no avail (no loan car either!).
It did I again soon after & I took it back & demanded someone from Nissan customer service contact me as I wanted a replacement car.
They scanned it on the spot & funny enough it came back with a fault code which indicated loss of fuel pressure.
The warranty claim had to be approved before they would touch it (it took three weeks).
So far it hasn't happened again.
It has also happened with another D40 but not as often & both cars were purchased from the same dealer at the same time.

D40s are a hunk of crap.

It was boiling the trans and diff oil when being used in 4x4 high/low when going off road, so we used an aircon condenser with a electric thermo fan mounted to it as a transmission cooler to stop it from boiling the fluid all the time.

The air intake on them picks up from one of the wheel arches, we took it through the wombat state forest, gone through a bog hole wheel arch deep......

Air intake sucked in the water from the wheel arch, into the turbo, seized the vanes and rooted them in the exhaust housing of the turbo, new turbo from Nissan $4000.

We got another new one for $1400 from a business in Sunbury.

His car has our initials stamped into it all over the place, when we fix something or come up with an idea, our initials get stamped into the fix we came up with.

[chevypower]

I don't think it was giving Euro's crap. It's just a reminder of the reality that all cars have good points as well as flaws. Some people do not use critical thinking and stick to terms such as "Euro quality" as it must be a given that the car must be well above average, just because it is European. So the quality issues don't bother you, but somebody posting a thread about it obviously does. Now does that make sense?

[Danny]

Oh Stevz, Stevz, Stevz. This news story was made to order just for you wasn't it? You'd be a rip roaring Today Tonight reporter

[Whitey-AMG]

Scary stuff -

But Volkswagen ( and many other EUROs ) - aint exactly EURO anymore - right ? A lot of their stuff is manufactured Globally. Indonesia / Mexico / South Africa / Spain / China etc.

Just sayin that just because it's a VW - doesnt mean its GERMAN build quality.

[SS_01]

Originally Posted by ESP

Scary stuff -

But Volkswagen ( and many other EUROs ) - aint exactly EURO anymore - right ? A lot of their stuff is manufactured Globally. Indonesia / Mexico / South Africa / Spain / China etc.

Just sayin that just because it's a VW - doesnt mean its GERMAN build quality.

Its assemebled in other countries correct, but the tolerances have to be within 2% no matter where the vehicle is assembled.

[Whitey-AMG]

Originally Posted by SS_01

Its assemebled in other countries correct, but the tolerances have to be within 2% no matter where the vehicle is assembled.

That's what the marketing guys at VW will tell you.
Indonesian tolerances within 2% of experienced german manufacturers.....really.

[GCRXR6]

Originally Posted by ESP

Scary stuff -

But Volkswagen ( and many other EUROs ) - aint exactly EURO anymore - right ? A lot of their stuff is manufactured Globally. Indonesia / Mexico / South Africa / Spain / China etc.

Just sayin that just because it's a VW - doesnt mean its GERMAN build quality.

I'll go along with that. Mercedes Sprinter vans are good examples... flamin' lumps of faeces.

[flooded one]

Originally Posted by GCRXR6

I'll go along with that. Mercedes Sprinter vans are good examples... flamin' lumps of faeces.

and the Vitos as well

[Danny]

Originally Posted by stevz

One would think that if you were driving down the freeway at 100 and your engine cut out the car would simply keep rolling, but in these cases it seems like there is a braking force applied as well, so there is a lot more to this than what meets the eye.

That's exactly what I thought. You're not wrong there.. I don't believe for a second that the engine going into limp home provides enough engine brake to make the car stop fast enough such that a truck can't stop in time to avoid hitting it.

I don't think the brakes went on on their own, that just wouldn't happen at all.. I reckon there's been some sort of driver error both in the GTI and the truck.

[burnz]

Originally Posted by Danny

That's exactly what I thought. You're not wrong there.. I don't believe for a second that the engine going into limp home provides enough engine brake to make the car stop fast enough such that a truck can't stop in time to avoid hitting it.

I don't think the brakes went on on their own, that just wouldn't happen at all.. I reckon there's been some sort of driver error both in the GTI and the truck.

in a HX holden premier with a trimatic box, if the engine cut out it would downshift to 2nd in an attempt to clutch the engine....fact.

[1TUFFUTE]

Id just like to point out that my AUSTRALIAN designed and built FG FALCON has never had any of these problems........

[DJM83]

Originally Posted by 1TUFFUTE

Id just like to point out that my AUSTRALIAN designed and built FG FALCON has never had any of these problems........

Funnily enough neither have either if my GERMAN designed and built Focus. But these things can happen to any brand.