Should I raise an official Police Complaint?

EDManual · 04-03-2011, 01:17 PM

Driving along the highway back to Geelong yesterday doing maybe 103km/h in came across a silver wagon ss commodore undercover police car doing maybe 95km/h in the middle land, went to pass him and he sped up to my speed (I knew he was a cop) so didnt speed up any more. Then I slowed down to 95, so did he, then I sped up to 100, so did he, then 105 so did he, then back down to 100 etc for maybe 5 km!!

What was he trying to do?...(its an easy guess) I couldnt pass him without speeding....

Anyway I thought "good stuff cop" so looked at him shaking my head and holding one of my hands out as in "what are you doing?" then he turned off towards Geelong and I continued down the Geelong ring road.

Now being one to have got a few tickets over time, It would be great to cause some problems for any Policeman doing the wrong thing.

I rang up the Geelong Station issued a complaint, but couldnt really be bothered with all the rigmarole of doing an official one. They said they would have a word to the driver of that car.

Now thinking maybe I should have done the official complaint, they said they would do an investigation if I did an official one.

SumoDog68 · 04-03-2011, 01:20 PM

Official complaint about what ?How can you pass anyone by going the same speed as they are . If you wanted to pass him why not just go past him at 120 otherwise just sit behind him like the rest of us

P.S. There so many drivers who "pass" at speed differential of 3 km/h or less and take ages to do so for no gain apart from their desire to sit in front of you.

dave289 · 04-03-2011, 01:22 PM

Probably not worth wasting your time over such a tool. There are to many for us to waste our life over, just accept there are tools out there and move on. Out of curiuosity how old did he look. You have made a complaint and he will probably get a talking too as he is giving those officers a bad name by doing such a thing and I'm sure most of them would not appreictaite what he is doing. As before ,move on buddy ,tools are not worth wasting your time on.

paule11 · 04-03-2011, 03:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dave289

Probably not worth wasting your time over such a tool. There are to many for us to waste our life over, just accept there are tools out there and move on. Out of curiuosity how old did he look. You have made a complaint and he will probably get a talking too as he is giving those officers a bad name by doing such a thing and I'm sure most of them would not appreictaite what he is doing. As before ,move on buddy ,tools are not worth wasting your time on.

+1 deliberately trying to frustrate people into overtaking . He should have had his cruise control set to the speed limit

GS608 · 04-03-2011, 01:22 PM

He wasn't doing anything illegal also why didn't you just ignore him? by you playing around like that you're just drawing his attention to you so of course he's going to stick around and play, waiting.

JC · 04-03-2011, 01:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 5.0

He wasn't doing anything illegal also why didn't you just ignore him? by you playing around like that you're just drawing his attention to you so of course he's going to stick around and play, waiting.

Actually, he was - it is illegal to increase your speed when being overtaken.

***EDIT*** Just realised the road in question is a multi lane road. Speeding up while being overtaken is not allowed on single lane roads:

145 Driver being overtaken not to increase speed

If a driver is overtaking another driver on a two-way road by crossing a dividing line, or crossing to the right of the centre of the road, the other driver must not increase the speed at which the driver is driving until the first driver:
(a) has passed the other driver, and
(b) has returned to the marked lane or line of traffic where the other driver is driving, and
(c) is a sufficient distance in front of the other driver to avoid a collision.

Smoke Pursuit · 04-03-2011, 03:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JC

Actually, he was - it is illegal to increase your speed when being overtaken.

***EDIT*** Just realised the road in question is a multi lane road. Speeding up while being overtaken is not allowed on single lane roads:

145 Driver being overtaken not to increase speed

If a driver is overtaking another driver on a two-way road by crossing a dividing line, or crossing to the right of the centre of the road, the other driver must not increase the speed at which the driver is driving until the first driver:
(a) has passed the other driver, and
(b) has returned to the marked lane or line of traffic where the other driver is driving, and
(c) is a sufficient distance in front of the other driver to avoid a collision.

This is an interesting one this one, the other day I was out on a country highway going through a small country town with a speed limit of 60.. So the limit was 100 then 80 then 60 then back to 100.. As I always do I backed off to go through the town back to 60 then when the 100 sign passed I put the foot down, at the same time the guy behind me in a V8 Adventura (Holden Wagon) thought he would overtake me.. by the time I notice him up my side im back nearly doing 90. In this case it seems I would be in the wrong?

Anyways I did back off to let him safely get passed once I seen him but I wasn't a happy little vegimite because after that he couldnt even hold 100...

EDManual · 04-03-2011, 01:23 PM

he was probably 45 or so years old.

gtxb67 · 04-03-2011, 01:24 PM

why - complain because he was trying to see if you were stupid enough to be baited
i doubt there is a single person in this world who has not baited someone before so why should cops not be able to do it

people complain because speed cameras booked them for small indescretions, but if a copper is trying to figure out who is dumb and who is not, or who is likely to go more than 10% over the limit that is wrong?

tweeked · 04-03-2011, 01:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by gtxb67

why - complain because he was trying to see if you were stupid enough to be baited
i doubt there is a single person in this world who has not baited someone before so why should cops not be able to do it

people complain because speed cameras booked them for small indescretions, but if a copper is trying to figure out who is dumb and who is not, or who is likely to go more than 10% over the limit that is wrong?

I cant handle this thought process. Police should never bait people. What next, shoot at us to see if we shoot back?

Their job is to observe and enforce the law, not to try to get people to break it.

gtxb67 · 04-03-2011, 01:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by tweeked

I cant handle this thought process. Police should never bait people. What next, shoot at us to see if we shoot back?

Their job is to observe and enforce the law, not to try to get people to break it.

i am not sure that the cops actually broke the law - they may have exceeded it by 5kph, but that is neither here or there, beause neither you or i was there to confirm or deny it

i take it, you have never baited anyone to try and catch them out or to get them caught - ever
everyone complains about copper's having special priviledges and now some suggest that they cannot even have the same priviledges as us

and countless times i come up to pass cars on cruise control and suddenly their speed rises to match mine. if mine drops so does theirs. considering i have been guilty of this sometimes and not realised i was actually doing it, maybe the coppers did not realise it either - but wait they are coppers. guilty unless proven innocent

tweeked · 04-03-2011, 02:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by gtxb67

everyone complains about copper's having special priviledges and now some suggest that they cannot even have the same priviledges as us

??????? Same priviledges as us???????

If I sped up and slowed down in line with another vehicle they would say I was racing the other car and my car would be impounded

Dave3911 · 04-03-2011, 04:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by tweeked

If I sped up and slowed down in line with another vehicle they would say I was racing the other car and my car would be impounded

Err... no it wouldnt.

Quote:

Originally Posted by zion

The reason they do it is because our favorite ex-prime minister John Howard got rid of the anti entrapment laws that made it illegal for the police to use any action which could force you to break the law, which means that now they can do whatever they want to to get you to perform a finable offence.

Who forced anyone to do anything? All this officer did was drive at or below the speed limit next to the OP. The op has control over their own right foot..... The OP did the correct thing (as he should have even if it wasn't a police officer) and exercised self control. If the OP decided to think with a peice of his anatomy other than the one on his shoulders, then he may have ended up with a ticket. Hardly entrapment.

Quote:

Originally Posted by zion

Other then that if you see a cop car speeding (without lights flashing) or doing something illegal while driving just copy him, they are supposed to lead by example so if he speeds match his speed (but don't pass him) as long as your behind him he can't do a thing.

Worst advice ever. Police (at least in Victoria) have the power under Road Safety Road Rules 2009 Rule 305 to not apply any provision of the road rules if, in the circumstances, it is reasonable the provision shouldn't apply. They can also negate the need, under this same rule, to display a red/blue flashing light and/or sound an alarm if again, under the circumstances it is reasonable for them not to or it is reasonable for the vehicle they are using to not be fitted with them.

Also any vehicle they drive can be considered a "Police" vehicle as long as they are driving it in the course of their duties. So yes guys, they can do it in their private vehicles too......

Quote:

Originally Posted by EDManual

As if doing 10 over is dangerous anyway! on this freeway, its DUSGUSTING the lows that the Vic Police go to to make money for the government.

Yep -I'm appalled.... a Police car seen to be doing the speed limit... in fact just a little under.... what is the world coming to.....

Just out of interest, what exactly do you epect this officer to be disciplined for doing?

dave289 · 04-03-2011, 01:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by tweeked

I cant handle this thought process. Police should never bait people. What next, shoot at us to see if we shoot back?

Their job is to observe and enforce the law, not to try to get people to break it.

Exactly .

Dave3911 · 04-03-2011, 02:18 PM

I am at a loss to understand what this policeman has allegedly done wrong - and so would any investigator (Police, OPI or otherwise) who looked at it. Even if you had an independant witness (which you don't), what would they report?? That a police car was driving legally within the speed limit?? This policeman did his job - by creating a visable Police presance that caused you to keep to and/or under the speed limit. Everyone here bitches that Speed cameras are revenue raising and what we need are more Police - yet when you see one, you get annoyed because you cant act like an idiot on the road.

The pure fact of the matter is, Police bait people all the time. Victoria police even have a couple of old "Bait Cars" that they setup at rail stations, wait for people to steal and then remote cut them out. They also leave laptops, GPS' etc. in plain view and wait for the window to get smashed. If your stupid enough to take the bait - you get caught. Simple, dont take it. Baiting is an effective and simple policing tool.

Also - you've got to have rocks in your head if you actually think that "this copper will be spoken too". The copper you spoke to gave you lip service, because he (like every other member of Victoria Police) knows that they are treated worse then crminals when ANY official complaint is raised. It's much easier to give someone lip service, who feels all warm and fuzzy, then let you make the offical complaint. That copper hung up the phone, muttered to himself and went about his day.....

Also - the HWP office in your area is at Corio - not at Geelong.

zion · 04-03-2011, 02:25 PM

The reason they do it is because our favorite ex-prime minister John Howard got rid of the anti entrapment laws that made it illegal for the police to use any action which could force you to break the law, which means that now they can do whatever they want to to get you to perform a finable offence. i,e tailgate you til you break the speed limit is a good one that they use alot now, as is the issue you are facing. Hell they can even line up with you at the lights and try to get you to drag race them, but if we try the same we get fined for insiting a public disturbance or as tweeked said have our car impounded for hooning, so don't bother with the complaint cause all that will come of it is a slap on the wrist and potential hassles further down the track.

Other then that if you see a cop car speeding (without lights flashing) or doing something illegal while driving just copy him, they are supposed to lead by example so if he speeds match his speed (but don't pass him) as long as your behind him he can't do a thing.

james22 · 04-03-2011, 02:38 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by zion

Other then that if you see a cop car speeding (without lights flashing) or doing something illegal while driving just copy him, they are supposed to lead by example so if he speeds match his speed (but don't pass him) as long as your behind him he can't do a thing.

I can see your license lasting a long time

Rodp · 04-03-2011, 03:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by zion

Other then that if you see a cop car speeding (without lights flashing) or doing something illegal while driving just copy him, they are supposed to lead by example so if he speeds match his speed (but don't pass him) as long as your behind him he can't do a thing.

Brilliant advice.

You do realise that there are instances where cops will cut the lights and sirens while approaching a scene as to not warn possible offenders of their imminent arrival?

Rodp · 04-03-2011, 03:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by tweeked

I cant handle this thought process. Police should never bait people. What next, shoot at us to see if we shoot back?

Their job is to observe and enforce the law, not to try to get people to break it.

Undercover police routinely try to get people to break the law - a lot of crime is solved that way. I've been baited several times by cops in unmarked cars. Personally, if you're going to scream off like a raving idiot at the first random person who revs their car at the lights, I'm happy it's against an unmarked.

To the OP, did seem he went a little overboard and while annoying, at least you kept your cool and didn't give him a reason to nick you. Wouldn't go to the extent of lodging a complaint.

pottery beige · 04-03-2011, 01:24 PM

cement comes in bags.. concrete comes in trucks.....

GS608 · 04-03-2011, 01:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by pottery beige

cement comes in bags.. concrete comes in trucks.....

+1

350125GO · 04-03-2011, 01:28 PM

OP I share your pain. I get this a bit even though I am a P Plater in a grandpa car. Cops at the lights/roads/freeways just play with me sometimes, i cant overtake because they speed up and i am not gonna go over the limit because they are a cop. Usually i just look at them and make a "wtf gesture" and they drive off. Pretty simple really, i dont blame them for doing it though, the more bogans in commodores off the roads the better.

EDManual · 04-03-2011, 01:30 PM

so you do gooders think it is fair enough if I was to do 111 passing him to get out of the right lane of a fantastic 3 lane freeway then get a ticket? Thats highway robbery.
Am I the one who would be the criminal? I'd be taking that straight to the media if that happened thats for sure. (In fact I almost should have done it just to highlight the stupidity of it all)

geckoGT · 04-03-2011, 01:32 PM

I would not worry about it, no harm done and he probably drove of with respect for you because you demonstrated that you are a responsible road user.

pottery beige · 04-03-2011, 01:34 PM

you must lead a fairly boring life if youre getting wound up over something like this......

The Yeti · 04-03-2011, 01:36 PM

I wouldnt bother with the offical complaint

but then I wouldnt have bothered with the phone call either

Hell I wouldnt even bothertyping the orginal rant here, but thats just me

Generaly theres 3 sides to every story, yours theirs and what actualy happend (typicaly 1/2 between), mate taking that into account I say get over it

SumoDog68 · 04-03-2011, 01:45 PM

Question is why did you want to get past someone but not exceed speed limit. If it wasn't a cop car you would just floor it and fly past him but in this case you did not want to risk a fine. So what is the problem here and what is the complaint ?
It is like saying I normally pinch an apple from local fruit shop but today there was a cop there so I could not do it. I will complain about it.

JC · 04-03-2011, 01:48 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SumoDog68

Question is why did you want to get past someone but not exceed speed limit. If it wasn't a cop car you would just floor it and fly past him but in this case you did not want to risk a fine. So what is the problem here and what is the complaint ?
It is like saying I normally pinch an apple from local fruit shop but today there was a cop there so I could not do it. I will complain about it.

I think that road has point to point, so you wouldn't speed anyway (103 in 100 is not speeding really). So at 103, going past the cop doing 95 would have been feasible, but when the cop matches speed, he probably initially was checking that the OP was not speeding too much, but thereafter, he was being an idiot, IMO.

SumoDog68 · 04-03-2011, 01:53 PM

On a road like that why bother passing 100 or 103 won't make a difference.
Personally if I overtake it is quick and decisive which could cost me a speeding fine ( and it has with a result being one year good behavior option).

FTE72 · 04-03-2011, 01:55 PM

I agree with JC.
We expect footballers and sportsmen to be beyond reproach and rolemodels for our children, yet we expect lower standards from enforcement officers......come on.